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I’m so frustrated!! I thought by now I’d be over it but I’m not. I also thought that maybe I was being to sensitive, but in hindsight, I just don’t think that I am. I have a tendency to post before I talk to D, and can usually work these things out, but the problem with that is – if I don’t post, then I’ll never get my sisters honest opinions and, shit, that’s what I’m here for, right?
As you guys know-D is doing well. He’s been sober for nine months. I feel his approach to his recovery sucks ass but have decided to take a different approach – the fuck it approach. Its his recovery. Who am I to dictate how he does it as long as its working for him and he doesn’t slip or cheat on me, then I’m good. He’s at a meeting now and still looking for a sponsor (ummm, yeah, ok, that shouldn’t take this long, but again, fuck it) and he sees a CSAT every three weeks.
So, here is why I’m frustrated: His communication skills, which had improved drastically over the last nine months, have been slowly but surely slipping away. He doesn’t seem to be as conscientious of my needs when it comes to my Migraines (which he was rocking at) or when I want to talk about other issues that pertain to SA. For example, when the bitch contacted me and I put it off to enjoy my weekend with my son at college, he took that as a sign to forget it all together. When I brought up that WE needed to go file the compliant he was a bit surprised, supportive but still surprised. Now, my son in college is getting ready to have Facebook privileges again and he needs to know this bitch is going to try to contact him. D thinks I was going to do it….ummm, no…that’s not MY job. I didn’t get my rocks off by her, HE did. When I explained that to him he began tossing and turning in bed like a small child. I asked him what was wrong and he said, I have a test in school tomorrow and now I have this on my mind. I told him, welcome to my world, this shit is on my mind ALL the fucking time and I work everyday.
But, the icing on the cake was this ***don’t worry, the post is almost over LOL***
We had an issue come up with my oldest son while I was away for the weekend. He handled it and while I feel he was a bit strict and I let it go. My son is 18 and got caught drinking. Not the worlds worst offense. He wasn’t drunk. He wasn’t driving but he did lie and in my book, (especially after all this) that’s a big fucking NO. When I approached D about how long the punishment would last he ignored me. The first time I let it go thinking he needed to process. The second time he changed subjects. The third we ended up in a very ugly cycle that we had when he was acting out and wasn’t getting along with my son who is now in college.
This has got me so bothered that this weekend I’m reviewing my budget and thinking about whether it’s time to cut my losses. I don’t know if this is from the SA or from the fact that he’s never learned how to communicate properly.
He could see a CSAT every day but it will never get him the right skills to be human and it’s not my fucking job to teach him. What happened to the man I had just a month ago? Is this the sign of built up frustration leading to a slip?? Do I want to continue living with this type of worry all the fucking time??
Thanks for listening and if you have any words of wisdom I’d love to hear ’em.
SS
Oh (((((honey)))))
If it looks like a duck, quacks like a… I started feeling very uneasy when I was reading this, because I am wondering, and please don’t panic, but it sounds like he might’ve already gone under. All of the tell-tale signs are there and the test just sounds like a lame excuse for guilt and shame.
I do hope that I’m wrong, however.
I believe that with ALL SA’s that they grew up without a healthy set of boundaries. And they are ALL very immature. So, the deal with setting a boundary for your son, doesn’t compute. Drinking at 18? well, who doesn’t? I’m not saying that it should be condoned. But you know, when they go off to college, they all drink. The lying IS a problem, however. The point however, is that if D never learned how to impose appropriate consequences because none were imposed upon him, then when you are talking to him about this, its like telling him that Queen Elizabeth is showing up for dinner in 10 minutes and he needs to set the table.
No one can ever say when its enough or when its time to cut bait and change our life’s course.
For me, its not an option to stay, because my psyche cannot handle any of it. But, its not just the slips or the acting out. Its what my husband DIDN’T DO WHILE HE WAS IN HIS ADDICTIVE TRANCE. He was a sorry excuse for a husband (which I put up with) and a provider for his fucking family!!! That to me, is the worst aspect of it all!!! He used other women as primary targets for his narc supply and I am just the coat rack?
He actually said, that the thought of living ALONE is TOXIC. Note he did NOT say that the thought of living without ME is toxic. Doesn’t sound like its ME, that he wants, now does it?
I think a lot of us are dismayed with our partners, not just because of the deceit and the outside activities, because those are just SYMPTOMS of the larger PROBLEM.
The problem is an over-whelming compulsion and a MO that’s been part of the very fiber of who they ARE. In fact, I believe that these behaviors are so in-grained that they honestly do not know that they are doing them and don’t really see the problem either.
I have often made an analogy to a freight train– barreling down the tracks… If you get in its way, and get crushed, well, what were you expecting? Were you expecting that it was going to suddenly stop all 2000 tons on a dime and then call its sponsor and then tell you that he was barreling down the tracks– fantasizing about a belly full of hot coal?
no. and why should he?
Do you tell him when you’ve brushed your teeth?
THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE FOR HIM.
If a mosquito bites you and you get an itchy welt, do you get mad at the mosquito? Well, yeah… annoyed, of course, but then you realize that the mosquito was just doing what he’s been programmed to do… and next time you go out, you wear bug repellent. 🙁
’nuff said.
God… my son with autism is playing a Lindsay Buckingham cover in his room… so, so pretty…
here ya go— (the original) enjoy! xxxxoooo L
As it turns out, it was SA related so I guess I posted this in the right place after all 😉
It was shame I think that caused him to be such a douche. Although he still hasn’t come out and uttered the words “I slipped and I’m turning in my chips” yet. I’m not real sure that he ever will either.
It turns out that in his SAA group, which has something like 30-40 guys on a good Friday night and no fewer than 20 on a bad night (what does that say about my area, stupid military), they told him that “Healthy Masturbation” was perfectly acceptable and it’s A OK not to tell the ol’ ball and chain. I mean, why tell her? Transparency? Hmmmph!
So, while he and I were finally having a grown up talk about the way he’s been treating me, like dog shit, I let him know that I searched his computers and wanted his cell phone too. I had this idea come to me from the SA gods that if he wasn’t surfing porn, that his other core problem was masturbation. So, I asked him. Naturally, he got all uncomfortable and started fiddling with paperwork and that’s when I knew he was guilty as hell. When I asked him when, he said about a month ago….the timeline fits perfectly. I asked him how many times and he wouldn’t give it to me, I asked him the last time and he wouldn’t give it to me. Then he told me that his SAA buddies said it was just peachy to do that because it was a healthy release.
The conversation went like this:
“I was in the shower while I was thinking of you about a month ago”
“I don’t believe that for a second, but that’s not important right now”
“I swear I didn’t look at any porn!! They say at my meetings it’s okay to masturbate in moderation. It’s called Healthy Masturbation”
I admit, this is a new one for me. I haven’t read about “HM” yet. Must be a SAA thing, you know, their secret squirrel Patrick Carnes bullshit, don’t tell your wife shit.
“So, what you’re saying is, it’s healthy for someone who is addicted to MB to do it in moderation? So, for me, if I do a line of coke, that’s ok because it’s only one line? Then, I can do say five lines because it’s not a gram right? Where is the line drawn for you? Once a week? Once a month? Five times a day?” By now I’ve turned into psycho bitch from hell.
He has MB three times in the last month. That’s all it took for him to be a prick. Pardon the pun. He says the mood just struck him. Wanna know why? Well, if you haven’t guessed it already – stress. Rationalization at its fucking best. I believe that he knew he was wrong and he felt guilty about it and that’s why he was being such a douche to me. He’s going to call his sponsor today which he JUST GOT last night. And, his sponsor gave him homework so it looks like this guy is legit. One can hope.
From there it got quite ugly for about 30 minutes. I said some hurtful things and he took it in. Not to say what I was saying wasn’t the truth. It was. I just could have been a bit more respectful. I was not JoAnn at all, not even close. He says that he was assured by SAA members that he wasn’t doing anything wrong. If you could see me right now, you’d see lots of eye rolling. What might be right for one addict is NOT right for another!! How could he not know that? What a dumbass.
Anyway, I’ll be revising my Boundary Agreement. He understands that I cannot tolerate this type of behavior and while I cannot control what he does to his own body, if he wants to treat it like a playground that is his right, I will not tolerate being treated like shit and with disrespect. He complained its hard for him to fully move forward as a couple with me dangling divorce over his head but I told him it was hard for me to move forward as a couple with his past and I had to have an exit strategy.
I know we’ll get through this, we always do, it’s just frustrating!!
Hi StillStanding,
Sorry about your recent troubles:(
I was thinking with the posts the other day about Carnes’ views on co-addict vs. the trauma model, that he does have significantly different views about many other really important things in the world of sex addiction, too.
My h went to a Carnes outpatient program a month into his real recovery and he came back and said that he had put masturbation into his inner circle and that meant it was something he could not do ever, under any circumstances and be sober and stay sober. I was stunned. I said, “that was a choice? You mean other men participating could say it was okay for them if they chose and continue to masturbate?” He said, yes, although they were “encouraged” to tell their spouses about it if they did. Did I mention I was stunned?
Fast forward to a year and a half later at Heart to Heart in Colorado with Dr. Doug Weiss. My h was explaining to him that masturbation is in his inner circle and that he had chosen not to allow that, and Dr. Weiss looked incredulous and said that masturbation is not sobriety for any sex addict under any circumstances and that it was not a valid choice for any recovery. Period.
MarieThen I’m not surprised that the addicts in my husband’s group are telling him it’s ok. The “best” CSAT in our area follows the Carnes’ role model so this is what they are all learning and passing along to each other.
Funny you mention the circle. D finally has to sit down and write it out instead of it being a list. His sponsor wants him to draw it out like a diagram. That was his first assignment from him.
Thanks!
SS
Update: D has decided to put masturbation into his inner circle and bottom line behaviors. I honestly was surprised because yesterday he didn’t seem like he thought it was an issue because “everyone else was doing it”. It reminded me of peer pressure.
He said he gave it a lot of thought and he’s afraid that it could lead to him MB more often and then before he knew it, he would be fantasizing and then what? Porn? He felt it was better to be safe than sorry.
Although, I can see that for some men who aren’t addicted to the act of MB like D is, that maybe it could be a healthy outlet. If an addict is addicted to something else entirely, like hookers or whatever, would MB be a better alternative?
I don’t know…
SS
SS, To answer your question, no way. My h was into hookers. After my first d-day, he kept masturbating. And then it got right back to porn and hookers. He was told by his SA group that it has to be complete abstinence (apart from sex with a spouse/partner.)
My take on it all was that over a certain period of time a period of abstinance is recommended. Abstinence inlcudes no masturbation or sex with his wife, GF whatever…no sex in any way. Then after a certain period of time, i have no idea how long, certain behaviors can be allowed back in. However i think a prostitue addict, could just switch over to porn and MB, if MB was still allowed. In my h’s 12 step they were allowed to choose what be in the inner circle…its all up to them really. but his latest therapist put a stop tp the masturbation. The first therapist did not and said he was doing just great (way to go enstein, he was wrong). however as you all know with the masturbation also was the porn, and he did not stop he was back at it after a few months. MB is not an alternative, its would end up being another way to get a high…
I think in the end. It all has the same damaging effect on the relationship no matter what they choose.Love,
FloraZG,
So it was like he was never able to fully clear his mind like they do during abstinence? I guess the dopamine fix was never met and so he kept escalating? I’m so sorry!!!
Flora,
I understand your POV too. That they can just change their choice of drug. So, I decide not to do cocaine anymore but I think it’s okay to start doing vicodin everyday. Different drug, same addiction.
I’m glad D added it to his inner circle.
thank you both!!
Hugs,
SS
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