Is it enough?

Oh sweetheart, only you know the answer. But as a sister who understands, Id say No, it is not enough. Yes, you deserve better than his very best will ever be able to be. Because he crossed a line and hurt you in a way you can never forget…
With love,
~Bonnie

Bev,
You are amazing. You have figured this stuff out so quickly after your discovery- your first discovery. You know who you are and what you want. You know the price that will be paid (which, I might add, you should lay at his feet- not yours). You are smart and strong and brave, and you will be a great example to your kids.

You are being selfish but in a good way- a way that validates and values yourself and your principles. You are authentic and unwilling to compromise what you stand for and what you deserve.

What would you tell your daughter to do if if were her? Would you tell her that she is being selfish?

Bev
I don’t know you or ur husband but I do know my situation. He should have a house full of academy awards. He found his own psychologist that specialized in sex issues, got prayed over at church, cried buckets of tears, bought me jewelry, teddy bears and cards. Found accountability partners. He even had his own doctor convinced that he had recovered

On the LAST d day of MY life, 5/29/11, I found out he never stopped. I always said that I would never divorce because of my kids. I would live as an unhappy wife for the sake of keeping our family together. Then I decided I didn’t want our boys to grow up thinking his behavior was appropriate. I didn’t want their brains to become numb to emotions, sex, etc. they both have such sweet spirits. I was afraid that his evil would take that from them. Living together, I had little control. So far, living apart I have total control. When I weighed out those two environments it was easy. My kids have been to counseling. I was worried because they werent acting out (bc of divorce). My h and I did not fight or yell. The counselor told me that kids know and can feel a lot more than we give them credit for. She said they probably “knew” how sick my h was before I did.
I believe Miracles happen all the time. My God is a mighty God and he is the only one that can deliver people from this sickness. But from what ive read only 5-7% of ppl do get delivered. That’s not odds I want to bet on especially with my kids at risk. Besides, he can get delivered whether he is married to me or not.

Like everyone else has already said – your intuition is telling you what to do. Is is so hard to let go. Maybe because we feel we are giving up on our dreams? Maybe because we think we have the power and strength to fix it?

It breaks my heart that you have to deal with this.

Phood – I’ve been dying to find out stats on SA’s – do you mind telling me where you found the 5 to 7% stat?

Bev – This is such a tough decision – one that many of us on this board grapple with every day. I’m ready to give it “one more go” for the sake of the kids and for our history. I have my moments when I’m triggered and it really sucks – I feel like throwing up and I hurt all over and I think I can’t do it any more – it goes against every value and ounce of my being to think about being with someone that could do what he did. I don’t hide my triggering moments anymore and that seems to help my healing. I’ve heard that they get less and less over time (can anyone on here confirm that?).

At any rate – it’s not a life that I would choose – but I love my husband and I think that he is sick. I don’t think he intentionally set out to hurt me. I will never forgive him (or myself for allowing it) for the pain inflicted – but I’m willing to give it “one more go” – but there has to be true remorse, behavior changes and I’m NEVER going to get blindsided again. I don’t plan to turn into a prison warden – but will be more vigilant.

My therapist seems to be of this school of thought, too – OK, once they realize they have a problem and why – then they are in charge of fixing it and if they screw up again – then it’s over. I’m comfortable with that because I love him, we have had a good life, and he has been remorseful lately and is making an effort. I am not pro divorce unless there is abuse (as there has been in our cases). Trust me – there are times when I’d love to run for the hills and start a new life and not have to think about the horror of this, but I have made a conscious decision to give it one more go. Only you can decide what you are willing to do. Give it some time…..and you will become clearer on your decision.

Deb

Who is “pro-divorce,” really? Maybe ZsaZsa Gabor. Most women take it up the ass for as long as they can tolerate before throwing in the towel. They do it for the kids, they do it because they can’t let go of the fantasy, they do it because of their religious or spiritual convictions, they do it because they’re afraid of the unknown or because of finances…infinite reasons. They hold on, do all the heavy lifting, all to keep the family intact. Hell, even the men aren’t pro-divorce; they just want to be married and “date.” Bev, whether or not you stay with your h, I hope that you’ll have the same experience I did in that the fear of aging; negatively comparing myself to supermodels, porn stars, and the high school girls down the road; thinking about his desires and preferences, etc., and the images of him with others that were stuck on ‘repeat’ in my head started to subside slowly. Three-plus years later, I am not really haunted by those any more. I believe that IF my SA were acting like yours, we’d stand a chance. Unfortunately, that ain’t the case. Like I said in another post, it’s his refusal to take responsibility for the divorce (“It was YOUR choice.”), his lack of empathy, and the same old narcissistic attitude that I can’t and won’t get over. Seriously–after everything he’s put me through, he thinks I will settle for anything short of princely behavior?! I pray your h will continue with his demonstrations of love and remorse. If he does that, those other triggers will heal with time.

Bev,
Your post breaks my heart. Because I feel everything you are feeling. Unfortunately, in recent weeks, my h has reverted to full-asshole mode. He made the promises to me, although I could see the writing on the wall. He didn’t like SA meetings and stopped going. He used Candeo’s online program, but stopped once the 6-month paid for program was over (opting not to continue to pay and use it.) He goes to therapy once a month–what a joke. I’m pretty sure therapy for him is just a complaint session, and that his therapist is doing more harm than good. And yet, with all of this, and even though I’ve been mentally resigning myself to divorce, I’m still heartbroken. I hate it for my kids more than anything. Your last paragraph could be my paragraph. And now I know he won’t move to do anything–whether it’s to really work hard at recovery, or just ask for divorce. He’s quite content with the status quo. And meanwhile, my emotional health is taking a huge toll. And so now, I have to strengthen up and take the next step that I am forced into. My heart breaks for you, for me, and for all of us in this position.
Sending you hugs…more than you can imagine,
Julie

Bev,
I could copy and paste that and sign my name…the similarities (well even among all of us) are uncanny. I too, met my husband at around age 24. Been married 20 years. I also don’t feel it was some kind of personal vendetta. I was and continue to be ignored. And the sad thing is, he’s bewildered by what I mean when I bring it up. 🙁
I just had a chat with the beautiful SL last night (first time in a long time and much needed!), and that idea of me having the tiniest shred of hope that my h would be THE ONE (even though I didn’t want to admit I was holding that hope out).
I’m finally done. 🙁
In any case, I’m here for you. We can get through this together. xoxoxo!

Julie, the feeling of being ignored and they don’t even know what we’re talking about.. I’ve found that to be one of the most gut-wrenching and anger-provoking things to deal with. And if we don’t start out with the greatest self-esteem in the first place, it is even more horrible. I think it takes a paradigm shift on our part, because God knows, a paradigm shift doesn’t appear to be in their future. A shift where it’s not just that we don’t let their callousness and their robotic weirdness affect us, but where it actually just doesn’t affect us. It’s easier said than done. I’ve noticed that after a therapy appointment and for a couple of days afterwards, I feel a little more clarity. Then as the week goes on, I don’t feel so hot. But you sound like you’ve had a shift, when you said you’re finally done. I hope you’re doing ok. Sending you much love and hugs. xoxo

He has been doing this not only all of your adult life, Bev, but all his adult life. His development has been totally arrested. No matter what, you are going to be light years ahead of him in regards to responsibility and maturity.

He knows no other way to live. Think about it…

Hi Teri-You are so right! When they have been doing this kind of behavior their entire life, and it is so engrained in their brain, (Actual changes in the brain that keeps the addiction going) there development IS totally arrested, and always will be.
My husband wants to change with all that is within him, and says he wants to be one of those 5% that can learn to manage the addiction/behavior. But, he just won’t be able to accomplish that.
He developed the bpd early in childhood and the avoidance in relationships to keep him safe. Then the addiction/or compulsive behavior, took hold-certainly a symptom of all of the maladaptive behavior.
He has a “boob” obsession, and even though I have a pretty big set of jugs, he would look at them, and it did nothing for him. I really think he adopted the “Madonna Whore” complex. I think the SA looks upon us as their security blanket, and the woman who represents decency. They can’t get into us because if they do, then they associate us with the “whores” in which they have been objectifying their entire life. If we are a “Tiger” in the bedroom, they see us as those women with whom they would never want to be with in an intimate relationship.-only a means to an end for
them. That is just one possibility in a long list of others as to why they can’t find us attractive, sexy, and want us in a way a husband should. I can remember one time when I started to disrobe and revealed the “big ones” to him. He looked for a quick moment and then looked away-they did nothing for him. I also think this is the reason for the sexual anorexia they experience with us. When they are horny, they can perform on a sexual level with us, but if it is any kind of an intimate encounter they can’t come through. I know some of you have expressed your SA has been able to be intimate with you, but if you really think about it, it is us that was feeling the intimacy.
I have had to wrestle with, in the past, of staying with Steve and accepting him for what and who he is. Some of you are wrestling with the same thoughts, but just think of how much of yourself you would have to give up to settle for crumbs you might get once in a while.
I know that right before I made my decision, Steve could send me some of those crumbs once in awhile. He could show intimacy on a rare occasion, but the following day or week he wouldn’t be able to perform sexually. The closeness was always just too much for hm to handle. Speaking for myself, I honestly got hooked into the good times we had and his continual promises of change. Problem is, the change never came.
I am being long winded today, but bottom line is we only have two choices – accept that it is what it is and live with it, or decide we need more than crumbs being thrown at us on a totally inconsistent level.
I feel like I am in such a good place now. I am 70 y/o and have no thoughts of wanting anyone else, and I think the age does influence what we decide to do in our lives. I thoroughly enjoy living by myself and have developed a very happy and rewarding life apart from Steve and his addiction. I have been able to detach emotionally from the old life and look forward every day to new challenges and activities to fill my life.
Do I feel sorry for Steve and have empathy for him? Yes, I do, but I would never think of reconciling with him the way he is. He does so much want to change, and it hurts me to see someone struggling so hard to make that happen, but no matter how hard he tries, it just doesn’t. He is stuck on a 5/yo emoptional level of development when this started to impact his life. It is very sad how parent’s can totally f–k us up, but for me, the pain will never be worth the gain again no matter how much empathy I have for a severly damaged man.
I get together with him for a dinner out once in a while, but with the full understanding I will never go back to the life I had while living with him, and I am okay with that. Quite honestly, after I spend a little time with him, I can’t wait for him to go home so I can enjoy my life by myself. When we are out in public, I could care less what he does as far as objectifying women-that is his problem. Again, I feel bad for him as I see him struggle so hard to change a man who is forever formed in that little boy mentality and unhealthy ways for avoiding life.
I have become very active in my church. Still doing Stephen’s Ministry and have a care receiver who is suffering
many of the same struggles as we have-not sexual addiction, but suffering with her own demons. I referred her to a very good counselor, but still continue to see her on a weekly basis, talk to her on the phone, and continue to offer spiritual and emotional support. I have to say it has been quite a challenge not to give advice, but that is not my role so I have been able to master that hurdle.
I continue to get together with family and friends, so my life is very fulfilling right now.
Hadn’t posted for awhile, so wanted to catch up. Oh, by the way, I came up with a good phrase for our SA’s. “Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Pecker.”
Love you all. Hang in there.
Love,
Sharron

Bev, the way you described your h sounds so like mine and our relationship. Even including couples counseling while he was off on a porkfest. You’d think any therapist worth his salt would have been able to key into something, but no such luck. Just thousands of bucks thrown down into a sinkhole. xoxo

Hi Bev…
That is the real sticking point isn’t it. I think i wrote that on another topic. For me i had already given my h one chance, that one slip. And that to me after all that came out that we were supposed to be honest…was the biggest crush to my heart and soul for a relationship with him. I felt like i was just waiting for it to happen again…on top of all the other past betrayals. I know how you feel. I could not deal with one more slip, oops, lack of respect and for how many more years of my life. And then also living in fear for that remaining time.

I think that if you are to stay with your h…you truely have to leave the past in the past. You have to be ready for the road bumps, and really have to feel deep down that if he did it again…you would be okay. You have to be okay with the slips…i think that is the only way to be happy. Otherwise you live your life with one foot out the door and the other inside in 5 inch heals…you could fall any moment.

I like to know what is going on and what is happening when. I like to live a stable life. I don’t like to live on the edge or in fear for my kids, finances and in my relationships.

Now that i am single…i am free to live my life. I no longer live in fear. There is so much to be said for that. And when you don;t live in fear…you can enjoy the little things in life.

Love,
Flora