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February 7, 2013 at 5:52 pm #6758
march
ParticipantUgh! To write all of this down is to have to face it. To share it with you all is to be held accountable for the decisions I make going forward. I try to avoid posting he-said/she-saids at this point, because after a while, all the events go down the same way, over and over, and we’ve all heard it before. I am going to break it down, though, so newer sisters can see my mistakes, what I’ve gone through, what I am still enduring. And what I’m enduring now should come as no surprise to myself or anyone else. I made choices–knowing the history, knowing your histories–choices made in malignant hope.
Brief summary to catch new folks up: Discovery happened four years ago in December. I believed his promises that he’d make recovery and our family the priority, that if I stayed with him, he’d make sure I was glad I did. About 8 months into that recovery, he stopped attending SA meetings and dropped his therapist. He offered to take a polygraph to prove he didn’t need those things and he failed. Then he took another, which was inconclusive, then he took another and failed. He appeared to be devastated, claiming that he’d have never offered to take it if he’d done anything. He printed out a stack of articles, etc. about the bogusness of polygraphs; he wrote the guy from antipolygraph.com–a long, passionate letter about how the bogus poly was ruining his life. I wanted to believe that the things the anti site said about polygraphs was true. Who knows? But I asked him to get back intro meetings and therapy, because by then I had “nothing to hang my hat on”–he wasn’t in active recovery and he’d failed the polys. All I had was his word, which will never again be enough. He refused, so I filed for divorce. He started back, but I went through with it, fearing that he’d just stop if I dropped the case. The day the divorce was final, as I was leaving to spend a weekend alone at the beach, he called and begged me not to give up on us, said we could make it work. We could start over. I spent the weekend at the beach, in shock after sitting in the courtroom. He stayed in the house. I told him that I would not shack up with my SA ex-husband, that if we were going to move forward together, it would require our remarrying with a prenup that would give me 3/4 of everything he has if he fucked up again. He agreed to that.
Things happened. In the divorce, I was given half his retirement account. He was surprised when I actually took it and invested it. My position was that if we were still together when we retired, he’d still benefit from it–it would be ours, just as his own would be ours. But I was protected either way. He couldn’t STAND not having control over that money, and he proceeded to punish me, raging, throwing tantrums, ignoring me, whatever he could do. So I told him to leave. When faced with leaving, he apologized, made more promises…it went like this, back and forth, for months, until, finally, in October, I actually kicked him out. He found a loser’s basement apartment about two miles from the house, a one-bedroom with NO space for our daughter. He was in there for a week before he came back, hang-dog, distraught, looking like he’d been in a war. He’d relapsed, and he wanted to share with me all he’d done, telling me, “But I can’t lose you….I’m afraid….I can’t lose you…” He showed me his new email account he was using to post Craigslist ads, ads for men, ads for couples, ads for a woman to be his partner to get into a sex club. Ads that said, “All alone in my new apartment, bi-curious”…exchanges with a gay (men) couple, an application to a high-end prostitute ($400 for 90 minutes). He’s joined a Yahoo strap-on group. In one week, he’d accelerated past anything he’d done before. He claimed nothing physical had happened. Again, who knows. But I was glad he came to me, showed me. I didn’t feel traumatized this time, but have felt a low-grade anxiety ever since that has gotten worse in the past few weeks as he’s reverted back to raging and blaming and gaslighting.
I reiterated my conditions for moving forward. If he was willing to sign everything over to me if he relapsed again, if he agreed to double down on recovery, I would stick it out as he recovered. Sometime between Thanksgiving and Christmas, he sort of moved back in. He has spent every night in the house, has full access to his family and home…and I have YET to get what I asked for. Right before New Years, he bought me a beautiful ring–a Lotus sapphire, set in rose gold, with little diamonds. We picked it out together. He paid for it and I put it on. He said nothing to me–not I love you, not thank you, not kiss my ass. The next week, when I asked for the money for the prenup, the raging began again. He said, “You’re too angry…you have issues…you are crazy…we can’t get married until you deal with your shit….” You all know the rest of the things he said. You’ve all heard them. He kept saying we needed marriage counseling, to which I responded, “I won’t waste another second of my time in marriage counseling with you unless we’re married.”
Then he gave me the money for the prenup, after which he began punishing me in fresh ways. He started drinking in the evenings after work, spending weekend days in bed. He keeps lists of what I owe him and deducts it from my child support ($60 to rent the steam cleaner so I could clean the carpet, when HE LIVES THERE TOO). 30% of Lola’s lacrosse camp, etc. When we go out to dinner, he wants me to pay half. When I balk, he says he’s just sticking to the divorce agreement, which was written the way I wanted it. Of course, never mind that the agreement only allows him to see his daughter twice a week and every other weekend…When I tried to talk about any of it (stupid me), he raged, beat his head against the wall, screamed how crazy I am and how nothing will ever be good enough for me: “You have the money for the attorney…you’re getting the prenup…and you STILL AREN’T HAPPY!”
We went to see a female marriage counselor Monday, a CSAT, who is not herself an SA. She was referred to me by a good friend of mine, a female CSAT. That went down the way we all expect: he blamed me for everything. He even blamed me for his relapse. When she asked him to tell her three things he needs to change to make this work, HE COULD NOT THINK OF ONE. He told her he’s a good person, he’s changed, he’s fixed his anger issues…. She took lots of notes, didn’t seem convinced. She asked me to table the prenup for three weeks so she could do an assessment. Not to push him to sign anything. She wants to meet with each of us separately and one more time together in order to make that assessment. Three more weeks. I told her that I turn 50 March 21, and that I do not intend to start into my 51st year in this limbo. She assured me I wouldn’t. She squeezed my hand as we were leaving.
I went home Monday night and wanted to throw in the towel. Finally. I wanted him out of my home. I wanted peace. I wanted to put his ugliness, his darkness, his illness in my past. But then I thought: I have the prenup being drafted. In three weeks, I will have an assessment that just MIGHT put this all on him. Slim chances, I know, but maybe, maybe she sees through him, gets it. After all, she did say, out loud, that I appeared to be experiencing terrible PTSD. And IF, in that assessment, she recommends that he get intensive treatment, or go to Minwalla, or something, and he refuses, I can kick him out. And THEN, when he hits his true bottom, as I know he will, and he comes crawling back again, I’ll have the prenup, the conditions he has to meet (given by the therapist HE insisted we go to), and he will NEVER get back into my home without meeting them.
Or, I make him go away now.
Yesterday, I went to the gyno for the first time in a couple of years. I’ve been afraid to go because my insurance is shitty and if I have something wrong, it will be a preexisting condition. All this time I’ve been expecting to get remarried and put back on his awesome insurance and I didn’t want to have a preexisting or to be on meds on record, etc. I’ve given up on that. I went, I got the check-up and STD testing again. I got a mammogram. I got a prescription for Prozac. Small steps, really, but empowering, to finally take care of myself.
I am truly a mental case now. I am losing weight, am unable to sleep, feel revved up and anxious without relief. It is as bad as Discovery. It is 20 steps back. He is a sick, sick man, and I’ve allowed him to nearly destroy me. Two and a half more weeks, if I can make it.
February 7, 2013 at 6:08 pm #75362allcat62
MemberMarch I would never judge any of the sisters for the decisions they make. You do what you think is best for your daughter and for you at the time. I’m so sorry that you have to deal with this horrible, sick man. I am concerned for your physical safety because the man as you describe him really scares me.
Getting the prescription for Prozac is empowering. That will start to kick in soon and you will be less revved up and less anxious.
He will NOT destroy you.
I will be thinking of you, praying for you and sending much love your way. xoxoFebruary 7, 2013 at 6:11 pm #75363liza
ParticipantMarch, you’ll find your way out of this latest circle of Hell. Take care of yourself, girl. Love you, Liza
February 7, 2013 at 6:16 pm #75364diane
ParticipantSigh and sigh again.
Thank you brave, March, for telling us your hell. It certainly sounds like hell to me. Now you’ve told us, and yes, it brings a certain damned accountability, doesn’t it? But honestly, I still think telling the truth is the only way home. I understand how ugly and long that challenge can be.Now down to the nittygritty.
Not quite sure still what the assessment accomplishes that you can’t already do right right now. I mean, you aren’t actually going to marry him, are you? So who cares about the prenup? Sorry if I’ve missed the point here March.love you
Diane.February 7, 2013 at 6:36 pm #75365daisy1962
MemberMarch, I’m going to give you my honest reaction to what I read: I wish with all my heart that I lived close to you. If I did, I’d come to your house, give you a little shake, then a big hug and help you pack up every bit of his shit and put it outside. He needs to go. I know you know that deep down inside. There is no fixing him, no redemption. It’s beyond that. He’s killing you and it kills me to see it. You are so strong, such a force of nature (I can see where Lola gets it when I read your blog) but he is slowly but surely chipping away at you, day by day. You’ve got to stop this or there’s not going to be anything left of our beautiful March. And it just can not be good for Lola to see this withering away of her mother at the hands of her father. It can not.
When you got to the part about your 51st birthday coming up my heart clenched in my chest. I turn 51 on April 6. A year ago, I was so looking forward to turning 50 because of all the shit that had happened in my 40’s (H’s affair, hysterectomy, my Dad dying, etc.). I thought we’d turned the corner, I thought my 50’s were going to be a decade of happiness and contentment. And here I sit a year later with my life in ruins, just like you.
I want, we all want, the best for you. I don’t think he is capable of giving you what you need or deserve. He’s drowning and he’s pulling you down with him.
Much love,
DaisyFebruary 7, 2013 at 6:54 pm #75366teri
ParticipantSo so sorry, March. I am glad that you have shared your story with us. I can’t imagine what you are going through- dday all over again? KMN.
I also don’t understand about the pre-nup unless you plan on marrying him again? That sounds crazy. A pre-nup is no magic bullet anyway. You can still do the 3 more weeks with the CSAT with him out of the house, if you really want to keep seeing her, can’t you?
I think it’s pretty clear from what you have written that you really need to be done with this. It sounds like you want to hang on for some kind of closure or validation, but you don’t get that kind of satisfaction from these SA’s. The only satisfaction you can get is to get out and know that you saved yourself.
March, you deserve so much better. Please take care of yourself first and foremost. Pretend your story is someone else’s- what advice would you give a sister?
February 7, 2013 at 6:56 pm #75367jos1972
ParticipantMarch, I don’t know what to say other than read what you’ve just written as if it were one of us who had written it. Think which of your sharp observations and advice you’d give us, then rally your troops and do it!
Hugs
February 7, 2013 at 7:22 pm #75368feelingconflicted
ParticipantMarch – first of all, I want to thank you for sharing. I know how hard it is to admit that things aren’t working out the way you had hoped. Having to admit your SA is just like all the other SAs in “recovery” or not. And like you said, putting it down for everyone to read not only makes it more “real”, it also means that you’re going to be held accountable for your actions moving forward by this group of sisters who love & support you. But part of the reason we are on this site is for some accountability, right? For sisters who know what we’re going through to help us see more clearly b/c it’s so easy to get lost in our muck. Being fairly new on the site (since Nov. so almost a semi-veteran), I have admired your strength and insight w/out knowing your full story. Now knowing this, only increases my admiration for you. It’s so so hard when we have hope and we see them getting better yet and then they do things that negate all the hard work they have put into their recovery. And not just negate all that work but “act out” in even worse ways. I agree with the sisters that you need to get him out of the house but I understand first-hand how difficult that can be emotionally. Taking these first steps and not being too hard on your self is important – he is the one who fucked up, not you!!!
February 7, 2013 at 7:46 pm #75369bonnieb
ParticipantDear March,
You have always been so full of humor and wisdom–one of the first women on this site to get through to me. I admire your sharing all that you have and are currently going through.
He is blaming you and thinks YOU are the one with issues?!? I can understand how him coming clean to you about his relapse would hook you back in. And I dont even doubt that in his ‘good” moments he is sincere. But it is not enough. You are worth more than that.
March, you dont need this counselors validation. You already know where you stand. You are a beautiful woman–inside and out. There is more life out there waiting for you! I pray for you that you will step bravely into 50 alone. Whatever you do, you won my respect and admiration a long time ago and that wont change. I just wish somehow you could see how worthy you are of something more.
It’s nice here on the other side….
Warmly,
~BonnieFebruary 7, 2013 at 8:24 pm #75370gail
ParticipantDearest March
Wow – you have certainly been to hell and back. I am so sorry for what you are having to deal with. You are always such an inspiration. March it’s time to think of YOU. You truly deserve much better than this. Sending you hugs and sweet dreams xxFebruary 7, 2013 at 8:25 pm #75371hadj608
Participantmarch you have attacked this from every angle. I am amazed at your creativity in this shitty situation. I think you have tried so very hard that you are losing site of everything else. Lola deserves a happy home and mom. You have done back flips to save your family. It seems with every fuck up you let go a little bit more. March you don’t deserve to be treated like this. And his blaming is the only way for him to feel better about himself, and to keep you in a weak state. He has stepped on you enough. Take the money and run.
Hugs
HeidiFebruary 7, 2013 at 8:32 pm #75372anniem
MemberMarch, I don’t know why it is so hard to just walk away after the hell we’ve been put through, but it is. I can finally understand why battered women so often stay, and I never thought I’d say that. Things that look so clear from the outside aren’t so clear when you have a history with someone. When you’ve loved someone through thick and thin and so much of your life has revolved around them. And going through this SA shit causes so much physical and emotional exhaustion that the thought of having to get it together to completely break things off is just overwhelming. Maybe if we were in our 20s or 30s and there wasn’t so much history, maybe it would be at least a little easier. Thinking of you and sending hugs and prayers for your healing. xoxo
February 7, 2013 at 8:57 pm #75373starwinkle
Participantbig hugs march.
And it isn’t any easier in your 20s or 30s with less history. I only have 3 years of history and i know that everyone here has told me to run and yet I haven’t…
Thinking of you and sending you thoughts xoxox.
February 7, 2013 at 9:00 pm #75374lynng2
ParticipantI am trying really hard to process this, March.
For some reason Hansel and Gretel keeps coming straight to my vision. Does that mean something to you?
February 7, 2013 at 9:37 pm #75375silver-lining
ParticipantMarch, forget meeting me for lunch- make the arrangements and just COME WITH ME to Panama City!!! I can take you to JoAnns!! We need to talk!!
February 7, 2013 at 9:54 pm #75376lynng2
ParticipantNot trying to insult you with fairytales. Something about trying to secure our paths, breadcrumbs. Visions of abundance that turn out to be facades. I think what you are envisioning will sustain you may just poison your life.
February 7, 2013 at 9:56 pm #75377desiree-larson
MemberMarch,
Thanks for your sharing. Thanks for trusting all of us to listen and to care. Take care girl. This stuff is so damn hard. What do you need for you? Is it possible to get it? God I hope so.
Warmly,
DesireeFebruary 7, 2013 at 10:09 pm #75378march
ParticipantThank you for your generous feedback. I think I need to clarify what I think regarding the next three weeks as they sit in the context of this history. I have found it IMPOSSIBLE so far to extricate myself from this relationship. Every time I have tried, I have failed. Why is that? I’ve ended relationships, marriage even, before. Something keeps me inexplicably bound to him. Maybe it’s just that I can’t stand the thought of my daughter having a father who fucks strange men in airport restrooms. I do not think he’s hit bottom yet, because I have saved him every time. He has punished me for this and I’ve let him. In three weeks, I’ll have a prenup ready. In three weeks a therapist might tell him a bunch of things he doesn’t want to hear. And he’ll refuse to comply. And I’ll kick him out. Then, if ever the time comes that recovery matters to him, that he’s willing to turn this train around, I will already have everything in place to get what I need to take that risk. And I can say, “Minwalla or bust.” And he’ll go then. I believe that, because it will be about him getting what he wants, and he does not want to lose us, because we are the only things standing between his being human and his being animal. He does know that. And, like bev, I think that would make him a better person and a better father, regardless,of what happens between us.
That’s why I’m considering suffering through the next couple f weeks.
Does that make any sense at all?
February 7, 2013 at 10:23 pm #75379teri
ParticipantMarch,
Of course, really none of this makes sense! 🙂
But can’t you have the prenup drawn up even if he is out of the house? And can’t you tell him Minwalla or bust now? And can’t you still go to the CSAT even if he is out of the house?
I don’t mean to second guess. You know your situation better than anyone, and you need to do what you need to do. I just hate to see you go through any more than you already have, if there is an alternative!
Can you take a couple more weeks? You and Lisa need to get your heads together- as in brainstorm together- on how to get through this surviving until you can go hellride you are both on. I feel so badly for both of you.
February 7, 2013 at 10:33 pm #75380courtney
ParticipantMarch, God Bless, and thank you for being you and sharing where you’re at. I don’t have words to express how sorry I am for all the pain and trauma and dashed hopes and everything else this brings into your life, but I can feel it, and I’m really sorry. The part where you talked about having tried and not being able to extricate yourself was particularly touching, I saw the pain from all of us in there, you are not alone. Maybe what you need is space right now, for each of you? Starting now 2 1/2 weeks of separate living and NO contact for any reason except a family emergency. He’s so chaotic, he’s not even letting you breathe normally, and they kind of like that, the addict likes to keep us off balance. Take 2 1/2 weeks off:) turn it around. Come back stronger, more independent, more beautiful than ever. I have faith in you.
February 7, 2013 at 10:36 pm #75381feelingconflicted
ParticipantI understand (kind of) the need to want the 3 weeks but also agree that why can’t you say “Minwalla or bust” now? From my own personal experience – a lot can happen in those 3 weeks that will suck you back in and you’ll lose momentum. To be blunt, I think you are using that 3 weeks as an excuse – maybe I’m wrong but I know that is what I’ve done. I didn’t think it was an excuse at the time but now I realize it is – I used the upcoming “holidays” – Thanksgiving, then Christmas – to buy me some time. I was going to make him move out right after the New Year. Well, guess what? It’s now early Feb. and he’s still here with no immediate plans to move out. Now Feb is our “birthday month” – both my daughters & myself have birthdays this month and we have a big family party on 2/16 so I can’t make him move out before then, right? (note sarcasm). I know intellectually that there is no perfect time…there will always be something that keeps him here. I don’t think it makes it any easier but recognizing that is important.
February 7, 2013 at 10:38 pm #75382nap
ParticipantMarch,
I read your words and heard what you said. It’s very sad and I’m sorry you have been suffering. Just know I care and I’m your sister. Being in the fire is so different from watching someone elses fire. Please just keep from getting burned.
Love you, NapFebruary 7, 2013 at 10:38 pm #75383daisy1962
MemberHere’s my concern March, a pre-nup is only enforceable and worth the paper it’s written on if there is a nuptial. For the pre-nup to do you any good, you have to marry him. If you really believe that he hasn’t hit bottom, then by any realistic measure, he has YEARS (maybe a lifetime) of recovery ahead before he will be a fit husband to you or a fit father for Lola. In the meantime, I don’t see how you will survive this grinding down or wearing away he is subjecting you to. If he is willing to go to Minwalla then make him going the first priority, not the last. Bev says her didn’t start becoming a human being until after he went. Yours is not even close to being a human being in his present state. You know what you would tell another sister: kick his ass out, no contact, no negotiation, no blaming, no gaslighting, no nothing until you do what I’ve asked you to do and that is go to Minwalla and get yourself humanized. The other piece I think perhaps you aren’t seeing is the clarity that comes from getting away from their physical presence. Right now, IMO, dear March, you can’t see the forest through the trees. You are a smart, smart woman but you’re so enmeshed in his illness that you are thinking as a beleaguered wife and mother and not as a therapist or a sister warrior. And you are both those things. I hope you will do as some of the other sisters suggested and read your posts as if another sister had written them and go from there.
February 7, 2013 at 10:39 pm #75384diane
ParticipantNo, honey, it doesn’t.
But it’s helping to know what’s going on in your head. Which seems to be some pretty intense compulsive over-thinking.
Something to consider:
sounds a little like a cycle is running here, and it comes to an end with the assessment, and then it will start up again. It may seem like a new thing, but it’s not a new thing. It’s the same thing. No wonder you are exhausting yourself. You are a rat on a wheel.What if its a very big lie that you are the only things standing between his being human and his being animal? I mean, Is that what you want Lola to believe about herself? That this is her purpose in life, and your purpose in life. March, you don’t have that much power. HE is the only thing standing in that place, March. It’s HIS responsibility. And it only works if HE stands between those two things. As soon as you put you and Lola in that spot, he doesn’t have to take it himself, does he? And he doesn’t, does he?
IMO, of course.
February 7, 2013 at 10:51 pm #75385march
ParticipantTeri, I asked the therapist that–can he just go back to his apt for these three weeks and she requested that I leave things the way they are. My guess is she thinks he would relapse again.
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