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Last night my SA had a buddy over. Things have been going pretty well between us lately, and I was hoping for a good weekend. They were out on our screened in deck watching tv, smoking cigars, having a few drinks. I peaked out and saw they were watching the lingerie football league. (I never heard of this myself until last night, and then googled it.) Well, I felt panicky and upset, and called SA in. His explanation, “Greg (the friend) wanted to watch it.” I’m sure he’s telling the truth. But does that make it ok???? In my book, no. Then he explained that he doesn’t find it erotic. (Ok, I feel much better…NOT). Also it would be over soon. (Still not feeling better). Then he asked if I was ok. NO!! He wondered what more he could do, as he was there for me “by coming in the house to see if I was ok.” Really, dude????? Thank you for choosing your friend over me. And thank you for finding a “safe” way to watch something, that at least to me, seems inappropriate. Thanks ladies, just had to vent…
Hi Zg,
I would have felt and had the same feelings as you did. The Immediate feelings we have after an event are the true ones and are not to be forgotten. As time passes we rationalize and minimize and think we may have over reacted . This is what happens to woman who are abused. I learned this at a woman shelter 13 years ago when my husband had lost control and hit me. They really emphasize not forgetting those first feelings because they are the true real ones.If I had to put words to those feeling if I was in your place I would say I felt disrespected, discounted, hurt, and a total disregard for the marriage and his ‘recovery’ work. He should have known not to watch such a program , then he should have stopped once it was pointed out to him. What he told you was lame and an insult, and you realized it.
I would have been very insulted and hurt.
Love,Nap
Poor choices, poor coping skills, lack of empathy, sensitivity of a slug = Sex Addict.
Hurts, pain, sadness, hypersensitivity, hypervigilance, PTSD = Partner of Sex Addict.
Big SIGH. I am so sorry. And no, I don’t think you were being overly sensitive. Even if all that crap was true (which it probably was) he is still underly sensitive.
Big (((((((((HUGS))))))))))
opps! Damn typo! Meant to say (which it probably wasn’t)
To quote SL, “ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME?????!!!!!!!”
He wasn’t turned on by this???!!!
I had never heard of it either…just googled it.
Drinks, cigars, his buddy who wanted to watch it???!!!
Really, if his buddy wanted to pour tar on a kitty and light it on fire, would he have been able to “just say no?”
I would have thrown his drink in his face and put his cigar out in his eye. OK, I probably would have been too stunned to to do anything but walk back into the kitchen but that’s what I’d have been doing in my head.
OMG, this all makes me sick. it hurts so much.
Sorry for you ZG. You don’t deserve to be married to such an out and out ass.
Debora
I agree with everyone else. That would have totally freaked me out. Even if he says he wasn’t turned on by it, I’m certain he enjoyed seeing beautiful women scantily clad in risky positions on the field. Tell him that would be like you watching football and all the players were wearing g-strings. Any normal person knows what you are looking at and it’s not the game. It’s all the personal shots of boobs and the like. Just like we would be staring at men’s crotches should we be watching them play in g-strings. It’s normal to go there.
But, sadly, these men are not normal. They can justify anything and you can’t believe a fuckin’ word they say.
I would demand an apology and add this to your boundary list since they can’t seem to read between the lines. They have no fucking common sense.
Your feelings are completely normal. And by the way, does the friend know that he is a sex addict? Any friend who knew you were an addict wouldn’t put you in that position. Just like a friend of a recovering alcoholic would never offer him a drink or ask him to go to a bar. He needs to confide in his friend what his situation is, however embarassing it might be so that he can make better decisions.
Of course, if you asked him to tell his friend his situation, he likely would just lie and tell you he did and then go watch the same program at his friends house.
Damn assholes. I’m so sorry this had to happen to you. Vent all you want; we are all here to listen and support you.
Much love, Claire
Z-
That would be totally unacceptable to me, but we are all different. You really need to spell out your feelings about TV and what things are acceptable for him and you. We don’t even have a TV anymore. I could not bear to have on a sexy commercial even if my h turned away. That your h thought that was acceptable shows that he is either totally out of tune with you, or you have not discussed what is acceptable for the both of you. If he is not aroused by Victoria Secret commercials, does that mean he can watch them??? I think it was a slap in your face, but I don’t know all the details of what is acceptable to you. In some relationships, men are allowed to watch other sexually provocative women with the wife’s consent, for instance. In those homes, I guess this show would be acceptable??? Each couple has to make their own “house rules”. I would have a talk about those I guess, so you are both on the same page.I am sorry you are struggling…I am going to hug you soon!!!
Love ya Z, B. TrayedBy the way, I was trying to be diplomatic, but I just read the other posts! I don’t believe he did not find it titillating. He fell into peer pressure and loved his friend more than you. Kick him where it counts! Insensitive little pre-teen! b
Overreacting, no way!
This kinda sorta came up recently with D and I. He’s made friends with a guy at school who is a Steeler’s fan. They have a Steelers rally here and D wanted to know if I’d be okay with him going. That lead to a discussion about them becoming friends and was this guy marriage friendly or not, and did he meet the standards we’d agreed upon. D said that from what he could tell so far, yes but if it turned out he didn’t he just wouldn’t go to the rallies anymore. Turns out he didn’t go anyway and I was concerned about nothing, at least the last two weekends.
Anyway, that made me wonder….what if this guy asked D to got to a strip club, what would D’s response be? I mean, it’s not his “thing” anyway. He was never one to waste money at a bar, let alone a strip club but still, new friend, new temptations and trying to impress someone and stay in the “guy code” bullshit.
So, I asked him and he told me he’d tell the guy no. I asked him how and he said he’d just flat out tell him he didn’t want to go and leave it at that – which, IMHO, is what your husband should have done. He should have said, hey man, what else is on TV? UFC? Football? UFL? There’s lot’s of “dude” stuff left besides whores in lingerie.
I hope you’ve had a chance to sit down and talk to him about how inconsiderate he was last night. I wish he had realized it on his own.
Big hugs!!
SS
Hi Sisters,
Thanks for the posts. As usual, you made me feel supported, loved, and gave me food for thought.
Claire, his friends do not know the situation. This is an old college friend, and he has not been able to fathom telling him. We are still at the point where nobody in our personal lives knows of this. I’m not naive about what happens when you keep the addiction hidden, but I also have heard about the possible repurcussions from other partners who have told friends and family. And…sigh…people are not always predictable in their reactions. So f-ing complicated…
On a good note, we did have a talk about last night, just a little while ago. Fortunately, he approached me first (while I was still mentally working on approaching him in a calm, rational manner.) He claims the show would not be a trigger for him. Who knows? Do I argue that? For me, that’s almost neither here, nor there, because I just can’t police everything in his environment, and nor do I want to. He’s at the point where he should be learning his triggers as part of HIS recovery. This particular issue was more about his senstivity and his handling of the situation. As we talked, he WAS remorseful. He talked about not always “getting it” yet (duh), and he expressed concern for trying to make me feel comfortable (which he has been working on very recently) and that he blew it. So it’s a small step…I’m too scared (and pessimistic) to get my hopes up for a long-term happy ending. But at least for now, it’s good to end the day on a better note.
XOXOXO everyone! ZG (Julie)oh, ps., Deborah: your SL “quote” cracked me up!! She will be so honored, I’m sure, that you accurately represented her while she’s away this weekend! I love that we all know each other so well. 🙂
Ohhhhh ZG
He can’t be watching that..,. He’d have to be gay not to have it be sexually stimulating. I’m sorry but what he said about that not being a trigger is BS at its finest. You may consider a boundary for you that he doesnt watch anything like that in your home again or anything sexually suggestive, this is my opinion and I care about you and I don’t want him to take advantage of your good nature.
Love, NapOhhhhh ZG
He can’t be watching that..,. He’d have to be gay not to have it be sexually stimulating. I’m sorry but what he said about that not being a trigger is BS at its finest. You may consider a boundary for you that he doesnt watch anything like that in your home again or anything sexually suggestive, this is my opinion and I care about you and I don’t want him to take advantage of your good nature.
Love, NapDear Zumbagirl,
I understand why you want to believe that all these behaviors are innocent BUT I just don’t understand why you do?? Your husband appears to be a walking advertisement for “NOT IN RECOVERY” in my opinion and he makes me really angry and I really worry about you.
HUGS, KarenYou are definitely not over reacting. My h’s csat said if you are not sure if it is appropriate substitute a male in the place of the female in question and you will have your answer.
Would your h be ok with watching men in lingerie play football?How would he have felt if you and your daughter were in the room with them?
Next time grab your kids and go sit down next to him, and show your disgust.
they are all so fucking clueless.
ps I am having a very pissy night ~ my h has been home for just over 60 minutes, he was gone all week.one of us has to move out.
frumpyYes ZG I’ll admit I was snickerdoodled almost to death and
I would hate for that to happen to you too. Don’t be a snickerdoolee anymore.ZG, you received such great feedback. I’m with those who
1. don’t believe he wasn’t turned on by it
2. think you should trust your first response/thoughts
3. feel just awful that you went through this
4. respect that this is your life and you need to decide when it’s not working, or if its still worth working away at it.But it’s getting harder and harder to listen to these woundings of the sisters I now count as a big part of my life. I want everyone to share what happenings, but it’s getting really hard not to scream sometimes.
Okay,
I agree with everyone here, but this is the thing. Husband was with a friend– smoking, drinking, and friend wants to watch the sexy girly show.
Yes– a “recovering sex addict” cannot watch that shet, however, and this is the really difficult part. But, how many guys are going to say to their buddies?
“Hey… sorry, dude, but I’m a recovering sex addict, (friend goes— hey, aren’t we all? hehehe…) and as part of my recovery process, I am not allowed to watch anything which might cause me to objectify the opposite sex, or turn me on…” (at least, not in front of my wife–hehehe)
🙁
Yes, I suppose that he could’ve come up with another excuse, like he’d rather have some intimate chat?
geeezzz…
This brings to mind a question.
Is a recovering SA supposed to divulge that information, as a recovering alcoholic would? Or is it a running (not very funny) joke amongst men?
The point is… that he obviously lied. And that’s the part that sucks. But, he might’ve been lying to himself too. I do believe that SAs often lie to themselves, as well.
And no, you didn’t overreact. This is why I need to get out of this craziness. too many tears. just too, too many.
ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME??? Lol…. Just kiddin, but I loved it Deb!!!
Ok, at the very LEAST, how bout he says to the DUDE, “um, we better watch something else. My wife doesn’t appreciate it when I watch stuff like this”
Ok, unrealistic? Sounds too much like a wimp? How ’bout this:
“Hey, we better watch something else. My ole lady gets shitty when I watch this stuff and I dont want to deal with it after you leave.”
Call me crazy, but there ARE other options, besides coming out of the closet!! Ugh! Even tho he NEEDS to!!!!
Oh yeah, lots of options…what about i want to watch the new episode of xyz or i would like to watch this movie. Really you can go on and on of options and easy ways to get out of it. h wanted to watch it, thats it. And if he can blame the buddy, well he won.
With my h he was told to throw it all out. Even r rated movies. I don’t think the lingerie bowl would have been allowed. Even the Victorias secret magazines had to be thrown out…he used those too. These are all things upon his admission that needed to be thrown out not mine. I was like really all of this has to go????
Anyway. There was no way he was not turned on. Could it have been harmless fun? Maybe, but not to a sex addict. Going to a strip club is seen by many as harmless fun, but again not to a sex addict. I like the example if it were men would they still watch it…obiously not.
I think to get the most support the h sould tell his friends to get support. Maybe they won’t support him, maybe they will. However he continues to lead a life of lies…to his friends and probably family. But the big point is here, he does not take the task at hand seriously…my buddy wanted to watch it. In the end it is he who makes the decisions of what he does and does not do.
I agree with silver, he needs to come out of the closet. However i don’t think he will, or that any of them will. Has anyones h ever told their freinds. I will start a new thread.
Love, Flora
Hi zgirl,
If someone has an addiction to alcohol or drugs, part of their healthy recovery is to avoid the people in their life who threaten their sobriety and recovery. Substitute sex addiction and the same principals apply.
Addiction looks like this:
1) blame- it wasn’t me, it was my buddy
2) deceit- if you hadn’t looked out, you wouldn’t know about it
3)justification- it’s football, I don’t find them attractive
4) rationalization- it’s almost over anyway
5) minimization- attitude reeks of “what’s the big deal anyway?” and you wonder if you are overreactingRecovery looks more like this:
1) I made an inappropriate choice and this was a slip.
2) I will talk to my therapist, my group about this and get back on track.
3) I understand that this has hurt you and affects your ability to trust me and I’m sorry for that. I will continue to work to make progress.You are at a really critical point here, zgirl. If you take a stand and say some version of “This is NOT recovery and is unacceptable to me”, do you think he would go to an intensive with you? How about if you told him you are going by yourself, because you need to talk to the experts and sort things out? And that would be a really excellent thing to do, for that matter. And tell him not to worry about the cost if an intensive…. A divorce is much more expensive.
If I could do anything over since d-day, it would be do to an intensive sooner ( we don’t live in an area with anyone who specifically knows about sex addiction/intimacy anorexia), so that both of you know what recovery looks like and how to proceed, and so that you know when and how to get out if recovery isn’t happening or going to happen …rather than wait for a third big d-day.
You have all the power here, z girl, because really you just have control over your own life and how you want that to look. Maybe just tell him that you don’t want a life with a partner who thinks that it’s okay to watch lingerie football and a multitude of other things and that you are requesting XYZ behavior ( intensive, etc?) and that he should make his choices.
Love you
MarieHi all!!
Zgirl- I am still at the lake and I have Internet service but no cell service!! But once I start the trek home and get into range, boy oh boy!!! I can’t WAIT to call you and discuss!!! And get ready, sister!!! You will get an earful of Silver Lining – UNPLUGGED!!!!
Great….. Now you won’t answer your phone when I stalk…. Lol!!!
Thanks again for all of the posts everyone. There is so much here, and so much info–so a big group hug and thank you. (SL, I’m running from you, girl, lol!!) I did convey to SA that the show was unacceptable to me, and he didn’t argue it. I think a point I wanted to make is that I can’t argue with him whether it’s unacceptable to HIM because it’s a no-win argument. (Even if he agrees with me, it could be lie). I did tell him, of course, that in MY opinion I didn’t think it was appropriate at all, and that I think he should talk to his group and/or therapist about it. To be honest, for the past few months I’ve seen a half-hearted recovery. So that’s why I’m not investing excess energy in what HE should be doing for HIS recovery. We’ve had those discussions, and I’m getting tired of that. So I’m trying to stay with the bigger picture. But without a doubt, he will know what MY boundaries are so I can be comfortable and peaceful in my own home (and so can our kids). Since d-day, he has not watched R rated movies, and I have parental controls set for nudity, sex, etc (esp with 2 teens in the house). It was just ironic that even after all of that, there are still so many shows that can slip through the cracks. It’s the world we live in, and that does give one a lot of food for thought, when it comes to living with an SA.
Marie, to be honest, I go back and forth on an intensive. I had a few days last week where I felt hopeful about the idea of it. Then I have days like today where I feel overwhelmed about trying to “sell” him on it, on the cost, the travel, the whole nine yards. I also wonder myself if I’m willing to take the chance and stay, even after an intensive, knowing that the possibility of relapse in the future is still strong. Part of my hesitation, of course, also comes from two big d-days. I’m not at a point where I am even feeling I can forgive, let alone move on together. I don’t know–I suppose maybe the intensive helps sort through those feelings?
I know I sound like Debbie Downer today. This is just a hard month. Our 20th annivesary is the 28th. And I know I need to keep busy that day, and all of that good stuff, but I just find I’m really affected by it right now more than I thought I would be. Every beautiful fall day reminds me of our wedding day, which was one of the best days of my life. I remember our honeymoon like it was yesterday. We went to Washington DC, so we could save money for a house (instead of blowing it all on a big trip). We had so much fun, though. Even during times in our marriage when things were weird (and I didn’t understand why at the time), that day always held promise to me, and we always celebrated our anniversary. (Well, ha–of course in recent years, I’m probaby the one who made the most of it.)As far as “outing oneself”, I do think it is different than alcholism. First of all, you usually don’t need to out yourself as an alcholic, or with any other type of substance-based addiction. In fact, usually the addict is the last one to admit it, if you get my drift. Then comes rock bottom, intervention, or whatever…I’m not saying that sex addiction should stay hidden. We all know that’s part of what fuels it. But I guess this is where more public education is needed–to really bring it out in the open. Maybe as sisters, this will be part of our mission….but I digress… 🙂
And Heidi, just thinking of you. If you want to share your week with us, please do. And if you’d rather not, sending big hugs your way!!
Love you all!! ZG (Julie)
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