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Gee, Everyone is on their own journey and there is no rushing it. We all try until we can’t do it anymore for whatever reason. None of us will judge you for that.
FYI, I thought for 6 years that mine was a “just porn” addiction. He totally faked recovery- 12 step program, sponsor, etc. We “graduated” from marriage counseling because we had improved so much. My world came crashing down last Oct., and I am in about the biggest nightmare I could ever imagine. Last Sept. I would have said we were a “success” story. Not great, but definitely improving. He said his had urges still but not often and he was controlling himself. Now I know he was never in recovery but was going to prostitutes, orgies, putting naked pictures of himself online, and giving porn to my (at the time) 13 year old son.
I understand wanting to hope and giving it your best shot. Just make sure to protect yourself while you are at it.
Thanks Teri, could you help me, us, understand how you found out or knew he was in fake recovery? It would be most helpful. Thanks, g.
Hi Gee,
I think we are all different. The women in your Cosa group have the marriage they want. That’s great. I didn’t. I didn’t want to spend my life catering to him, walking on eggshells, making do with bad sex and no emotion or spiritual intimacy, going to endless meetings because of them, never knowing when the next shoe would drop, being labelled by his “secret club” as codependent or co-addict etc.So women have to make their choices. And if they can live those lives and say they are happy—then that’s fine. But I can’t lie.
I tried for two years, and endured lies, abuse, insults, from my SA/compulsive and his treatment model. I got out alive.
I have a success story now, however, with a man who isn’t a liar, is present in our sex life, is emotionally availabe, doesn’t need to label me in order to “manage” me. So there are success stories to be had even in our leaving.
Sure- my son was using dad’s computer and his dad had left it logged in to a secret yahoo account that he used for all his sex stuff. He also hid his communications using an iphone. I never got anything from the phone, but he has admitted to that. Later, I needed to prove he was still not in recovery because he was asking for more visitation with my son. We used keylogger on his girlfriend’s son computer to get other evidence (she was using her 12 year old son’s computer to communicate with my STBX and arrange their orgies and other fun stuff). Also hired a PI to take photos outside of his apartment (where he takes my son) of people he was having for an orgy…
But that is just hard evidence. I think if you read the posts on the things they say when they are not really in recovery, you don’t really need all that. Things like “The guys at my 12 Step meetings are so much worse than me.” or “You are never going to get over it.”- I think For-now just pulled up a thread about those. I didn’t know all that then because I didn’t have SOS. And he was careful not to say too much anyway. He works a lot and was always busy with more work when he was home. But every once in awhile, he would get mad and let one of those slip.
In retrospect, I feel pretty foolish. But I really wanted my marriage to work at least long enough to get my kids launched. So I figured as long as we were making progress, I was okay. Our progress was really him getting better at lying.
Thank you, all. Terri, this is very frustrating to say the least. My SA does say some of those quotes, like some of the other guys are worse…child porn or child molesting, so does that mean he is faking it? Of course Im naive, I’m not an addict…any further words of wisdom is sure appreciated. Gee
Gee – I’m so sorry for what you’re going through. Definitely can relate! I look for happiness in small ways – my amazing daughters, good friends, a job I like, a good work-out, beautiful weather, etc. I try not to focus too much on what I’m losing (a husband who I knew wasn’t perfect but thought we had something special and the dream of the life I thought I would have for years to come) but it’s hard not to get sad and depressed at times.
Regarding the fake recovery – that has been my biggest fear. I don’t want to live another 10 years with this and find out he was fooling me again. What I’m finding is that once your antennas are up and you’re truely ready to face it, stuff will start to reveal itself. I also do a lot of detective work digging through our bank accounts, keeping a log of what he tells me, what time he does stuff. It’s a bit exhausting (and some might say not very healthy) but it’s something that I know I need to do for me so when he gaslights me (which he did in a long convo today), I can read through all that I have gathered and remind myself I did not imagine this stuff.
Thanks FC. See, mine was so manipulating, there’s no catching him…he saved up cash and didn’t act out too much at once…I make a lot of jokes, like he had a period..he started the intercourse a lot these last 3.5 years, during work hours, while I was pregnant also, and once a month, and never left any traces…no credit cards, no bank stuff, no phone stuff, gave me his iPod which was instrumental to pushing the addiction into overdrive. So I’m in a real awful situation. I didn’t snoop before and now would be a waste. Mine was too devious, girl. Thank you for your reply..please keep posting. Gee.
Oh, I tried to work on it, many times. In the end – he turned on me with a vengance I never dreamed possible. Really work on it – hmmmmm. Well that obviously did not happen. Although he agreed to poly tests. In the en it just brought out his original mommy trauma that he projected on me. What did I get for staying and trying? PTSD. Relative poverty. 3 kids that don’t know what to think but who have likely absorbed his shame. I lost my house, my mental health, my career, many friends who were so sure he was just the nicest guy.
One goo thing I did get for staying was more from the divorce – I ended up with health care and pretty good retirement. Don’t have much income now because I can’t work. Can’t tolerate stress. My body pours out stress hormones on a regular basis. I feel sick to my stomach and scared most of the time.
He acts like all my issues are from my childhood. His therapist taught him that. Shit.
I couldn’t leave early on. We had 20 years. He is a convincing pathalogical liar and acted out hundreds if not thousands of times. One time he lied to me for 8 years straight then was mad at me because I was upset. I cut my lovely long hair. couldn’t see colors and I was an artist. Couldn’t work. Could no longer dress up nice or wear jewlery. Lost my sense of being imortant to anyone for any reason.
Please be careful. Try to work through denial. These guys often are very damaged, with little hope of recovery.
My ex – has lived in a 12 x 12 room for 3 years after 20 years of playing “the good family man”. My kids wont ask what happened and he sure as heck is not telling.
Sorry the news is so bad. Now I live in fear of him coming to get me and make me stop telling the truth – by me not being alive. That is what I got. Never dreamed it would devolve – boy did I learn the hard way.
Good news. Have found a sweet man. He is different. So refreshing.
Take care and know that l care about your healing, not his,
DesireeHi Gee,
Poster child for try to make it work here. Went on national TV and told everyone exactly HOW we were trying to make it work.
It didn’t.
It won’t.
After a year of recovery, he’s still in denial, we’re five states apart and I’m trying to find a job still, with two children to support.
He says he is going to win me back. I gave him 3 things that must be done for the family to be reunited. It’s been seven months. There’s no progress on any of them at all. He forgot what they were.
No good news here.
There are good news sites. I tried them. The focus on the partner’s part in this was sickening. This ‘addiction” has been in my husband’s life for 40+ years. I met him 2.5 years ago. He absolutely lied about every bit of this because I did have that conversation with him, no porn, etc. 3 times before we married. Three days before our first anniversary, I found emails to whores. It mushroomed from there. I’m still finding out things. It has been devastating and horrifying and completely changed my view of the world and sexuality in society.
I am not, nor will I ever, accept that I had any part in his “addiction”. I can’t stomach those sites. This was always his choice. My only choice is to keep THAT choice away from me and my children.
Gee, when he says things like ” I’m not as bad as…blah blah blah” that means he is minimizing and that means he is not absorbing his therapy very well.
If I throw a punch and break your jaw and say at least I didn’t set you on fire and burn you alive then I don’t think you are going to have much faith in my anger management class 🙂
gee – Your story is a sad one. I just wanted to answer your question about faking it. Because your h is comparing his addiction to others in the group, and feeling he is not as bad, does not necessarily mean he is faking it. It probably means he he is in denial that he really has a problem. It takes a long time before the SA really starts to get it.
My h went through 2 therapist’s, worked on Recovery Nation, and attended an Intensive out-patient treatment program. He continually made such statements such as, “It is just a habit” thinking he could break it himself.
After After 2 and 1/2 yrs. of this stuff, he finally admitted he had a problem and appeared to be honestly working on recovery. Unfortunately, even though I believe he wanted to get over his addiction, he still acts out and lies on a regular basis. I think they are much more comfortable living the addiction than getting well. They have managed their life by addiction for so long, their brains have changed, (programmed for addiction) and it takes years to see change, if ever. It is almost impossible to unchain the brain. The SA has to totally restructure the addicted brain by learning healthy coping skills to replace the dysfunctional ones – not an easy accomplishment. The best a spouse can hope for is the SA learn to manage the addiction. They are never cured, and there are usually slips and relapses that may pop up down the road – even with the best of intentions.
As far as how do we know if our SA is motivated and sincere about change without constant checking on them? By their behavior – not what they say. You would hopefully see admission and disclosure for everything they have done. (Not likely). You will see true empathy towards you for their behavior, (An SA does not know how to show empathy) and most of all you would begin to feel a closeness, connection, and intimacy from them that you have never felt before. In the past, you were the one feeling intimacy (maybe) because you didn’t know any different.
Sorry I am painting a negative picture, but unfortunately it is what it is.
Hope this helps.lynng2 – Your story is like mine and so many others. I would like a dollar for every time my h told me he was going to change, was going to win me back – I would be rich.
OMG, Bev, that’s too funny. It reminds me of all the flack I got from STBXSAH when he said I was trying to kill him that time I destroyed the computer with the cleaver. He was so NOT the focus of that night. but as usual, in their eyes everything is about them, so picking up a knife meant it was meant for HIM and him alone.
After the ninth or tenth time he brought that up I said “At least I let you live”
LOL, that retort has haunted me, you can bet.
Oh, forgot to add…in the early years when I threw something and broke it after a disclosure. I was advised to go to anger management by his therapist. My anger was not to be tolerated. No one addressed that I had every right to be angry. Well I went to a full class. I was the only woman there. I cried most of the way thru it. He…..was empowered that I really was part of the problem. All his therapist and COSA ever wanted to do was have me look at my part. INSANITY – I got the biggest helping of it – his therapist got oodles of $$$$, he got more years of acting out and more years of faking being a good family man to my kids. XXXXXXX Someone should be in jail!
How can we go through all this pain and come out OK? I don’t know, but I am going to find out.
Well, at least our CSAT said he supported me in mine. He said that clearly in the second disclosure “Your wife’s anger is justified, I can support her statements”. Whew, but that on my way out the door when he let STBXSAH completely manipulate a second disclosure intentionally. I would have been happier if the CSAT had called him on the mindfuck and stopped the session before I had to. I was so in shock it took me almost 25 minutes.
Sounds like me yesterday – I walked out and the CSAT said nothing and neither did my SAH – oh wait he asked if I would be gone this weekend so he could come home to get the hot tub up and running for the kids when they come home for the holidays. No stop Trish – let’s keep talking, no nothing.
Gee- if your SA leaves no trace and totally fooled you then how will you ever know that he is in recovery? How is he accountable to you? How is he an open book? Can you live with knowing that you can’t know (none of us can, really, when you get down to it) and that it might all happen again? Are you willing to bet your life on trusting him with no way to verify that he is telling you the truth?
And I have to say, I have nothing good to say about someone who would screw around on their wife while she is pregnant. He is endangering not only his wife but his unborn child.
I don’t know what to tell you, Gee, but I would be pretty scared if I were you.
Yeah, what’s up with that, Trish? They start a totally unrelated conversation like the comment you made, or what is going on, doesn’t exist at all. Just a total redirect. They think that actually works? That nobody notices? It’s eerie.
Maybe part of the compartmentalization, and they don’t know we can see it happening. Ostrich head in the sand.
Gee,
Your husband sounds just like mine. He is doing something but I can’t catch him – he is so crafty. I had his desktop and an old laptop checked out and no porn there. Two days after our MC told me what would it take for me to believe he wasn’t lying and I said forensics on all computers, polygraph, monitoring, and then tow days later his iphone craps out! He wrote to our counselor how mortified he was! When he was trying to clear all this up! Poor him.How did you catch him Gee?
Sharron – you speak such wisdom. I truely believe my SAH doesn’t want to have this addiction but he is not interested in doing the work it will take to even get sober, let alone have recovery. Whenever I bring up just the idea of us seperating, he reacts with anger and loves to compare his addiction to alcoholism and says that if he were an alcoholic, I would stick with him through this yet anytime I bring up that many alcoholics go to AA meetings every single day, and quit drinking completely, suddenly that’s not really necessary for an SA.
FL, I never found a single thing on my H’s laptop for the simple reason that he always kept the bad stuff on flash drives. Just because there’s nothing on a computer doesn’t mean there’s nothing bad. If I were you I’d look for flashdrives. Mine kept his in his briefcase and always had some excuse to keep it with him. That’s what made me suspicious. Sorry.
Mine had remote drives and proxy servers and the whole thing rigged to destroy everything as soon as it was opened without a biometric password. He was/is slick as glass.
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