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Bev, I get what you are saying. But I get the wonderful joy (as does Cindy) of being evaluated for mental “issues” for the court.
So do my PTSD symptoms mean I won’t have anything or do they mean that I have whatever comes closest in their little book?
Along those lines, I just got my son’s eval back. It reads something like this: “even though none of the tests say he has these things, we are going to say he does anyway.” I don’t know if this helps me (by giving me something I can say,”see he needs to be homeschooled- wink, wink) or it hurts me (as in the court is going to require something that really makes no sense for this child). But it gives me no confidence for my evaluation.
Have him evaluated. He can ask…so can you. I hope they are paying for all of these tests that they are subjecting yout to. They are expensive!!!! These tests costs oodles of dollars. If he can;t afford nada…then where does the cash come from for all this. We know…they lie. Its terrible.
I don’t even understand what the pupose of the evaluation is for? If anything I would think it would benefit you. If you prove that your anxiety is too great to go to work, college, etc. How do they expect you to make $30,000 a year? Wink Wink.I did freak out everytime something came up. Speaking of which its time to adjust the child support. We went and ahead and settled in January, with the assumption that it would be modified…has to be a 15% change. SA went from $13 hour to $28 and we need to make sure there is a 15% change…and atty is asking for a $1500 retianer. I am going to see if i can do it for free through the court system. Its just numbers.
Stress.
Just angry at the world right now…:-(
Flora
I’m really sorry Cindy. I don’t even know what to say about all this. IF you truly believe you are unable to work (and it is DEEPLY unfair that you should even be requested to after working 27 years in the home) THEN you are going to have to provide proof of it…or so it seems? That seems to be his position- either work or prove you cannot? I would think it is your lawyer who needs to figure ALL this out for you? that is why you are paying him?? There is the law and there is what is morally right and the two are not necessarily the same. After 27 years of marriage you should be entitled to lifetime support and in Canada you would be BUT husbands often chnage their financial situations and cry “I have no money” in order to avoid paying. It is despicable but I have seen it many times in my H’s field where the men can run off and work in far flung countries where the laws of the West cannot touch them. I have ALWAYS had that thought in the back of my mind in my own situation and it has factored in to MANY of the steps I have taken.The only thing I can suggest for you is do you have ANYTHING that you can use to manipulate your husband….ANYTHING you can use against him? Can you make him sell the business? Without the business the playing field would be more ven and then HE would have to also compete in the job market as an older person. You and your lawyer have to find his point of weakness and go after it because he is not going to do ANYTHING for you Cindy- the sack of shit.That is the only thing I can suggest and I am sure you have already thought of it. 🙁 Other than that….a good Dr to say you are not fit to work. i don’t see the real problem with that? People go off work all the time because of stress? The only thing is…it may only buy you a certain amount of time…I don’t know. It is completely lost on me why you even have to do this. Again Cindy…I am so mad and so sorry this is happening to you. Karen xx
My trauma therapist is a clinical psychologist (I’m not sure what the exacts are in the US and Canada) but here in Australia, clinical psychologists are the one’s that specialize in mental illness diagnosis, and only them and psychiatrists are allowed to make a formal legal diagnosis. Normal psycholgists, therapists, and counsellors cannot.
I asked her why am I not diagnosed with PTSD when I meet like 98% of the diagnostic criteria? My symptoms exceed all minimum requirements, but my “situation” doesn’t fit neatly into an A1 event. She’s very ‘by the book’ and she said even though I have strong PTSD symptoms, a formal diagnosis of PTSD from being a partner of sex addict would not be accepted legally in a court of law, C-PTSD is not officially recognized, and told me about a bullying victim client whose normal PTSD diagnosis was ripped to shreds by lawyers because of the DSM’s definition of “traumatic” event. The lesser diagnosis that can be applied to us is Adjustment Disorder, which is lame if you ask me, a total minimization of what we suffer. It’s vague and it doesn’t even touch on the actual trauma symptoms. It’s like a “filler” diagnosis for people not fully fitting anything else.
It seems most partner experiences are just not taken seriously enough by others as being really traumatic. No one who hasn’t been through this can understand what we really go through.
You’ll notice even Barb Steffens and Omar Minwalla can only say trauma and “PTSD symptoms” and “PTSD-like” , as opposed to PTSD (disorder). We ARE trauma survivors, but it just comes down to whether it can be recognized as the disorder or not. I asked my therapist, what’s the difference inside the brain between what I’m chronically suffering with and if it were instead the disorder, and she said there’s nothing different, the exact same thing is happening inside my brain, but the disorder is just a label. And the A1 criterion is very controversial.
For me, this is beyond anything traumatic I’ve ever experienced (edited…) I did feel traumatized by some of that, however, NOTHING HAS COMPARED TO THE TRAUMA OF SA.
Thank you all for responding to me and being supportive.
I do have a medical doctor. She is aware of what is going on with me as a result of having to do several tests for STD . I have not gone to see her for really anything else. Perhaps I should get an appointment.
It is scary to think that people are not being diagnosed with PTSD when they have all of the symptoms. It really is just more of the same. To me it just goes along with everything else that is happening that makes this whole thing seem “unreal”. Is this happening, or is this not happening? Did we have a marriage or did we not? Are we just in some kind of dream state and just out of touch with reality? Is he a SA or is he an Ass? Where is the validation in anything that we are experiencing. The only real validation is what I receive from all of you here on this site that know first hand that this is real.
The reason he can have me evaluated is because I am asking for spousal support. Yes these test are so expensive and I do not understand how we are paying for this because he keeps saying we do not have money. It really does not matter if it comes out of his side of the balance sheet because what comes off of his automatically affects mine because I am financially dependent on him.
I am not sure how to identify his weakness. The only thing I can think of is somehow telling his girlfriend about the SA. But I am not sure how to go about that. He has all of his canned and well rehearsed comebacks all lined up. This shuts down any communication with anyone who tries. What he is telling everyone is that he went to one massage therapist appointment that got a little carried away. He went to SA treatment because he was so ashamed of that, but he really is not a SA. He is saying that Cindy is just so upset about that one time, that she is unable to forgive him. Cindy’s emotionally volatile reaction is what cause the demise of the marriage. This is probably what he told his girlfriend and she is buying it. What is my recourse against someone who lies. The legal system with the No fault divorce does not allow for any of these allegations to be a part of the divorce proceedings. I am not sure if the exposure of the SA will now be a part of the proceedings now that it is a factor in my mental well being and my ability to support myself.
If we were physically attacked by our husbands would spouse be more protected?
Victoria, I am shocked by what you write and what happened to you. To say I am sorry that this was your experience does not match the sadness in my heart for you. I just want to reach out and hug you and make sure your OK. How do you cope with all of that and than SA on top of that? It is beyond my ability to fathom. For you to say that nothing compared to the trauma of SA after what you experienced is a huge validation to all of us here as we cope with this. My heart is softened by your experience.
Sending hugs to all of you!!
Cindy
Thanks Cindy, I am okay. Apparently I am resilient. Although, this SA horror has shattered my mind’s ability to cope.
There were a few quotes I came across on blogs from other partners of SA’s that were really very validating for me:
“I have witnessed the murder of a loved one and I have been raped. Still nothing has hurt me, confused me, simply halted me & changed me, as much as this experience has. Nothing.”
“I used to be married to a drug addicted man who beat me so badly he fractured my skull. But his sex addiction was more painful.”
It’s all so very tragic. And the invalidation for partners is just unbelievable and as you said “unreal”.
I think the blaming is so difficult to deal with emotionally. It became like the icing on the cake for me. I mean here we are, innocent, and had our entire lives torn apart in the most painful, sudden, and shocking way imaginable, then automatically it’s all our fault and we’re the crazy over-reacting ones. It is so very wrong. And others buy whatever lies they say, because it is much easier to believe that a woman is just “nuts” and overly emotional than to believe a man is capable of such extreme betrayal, deception, and a double life. I felt so powerless and helpless with all the blaming.
Sending many hugs back to you!
Cindy, even if there’s a problem getting a PTSD diagnosis, I still think your medical doctor could diagnose you with exhaustion at the very least. Especially if she’s aware that recently you were also caring for your dying mother and then grieving for her loss, on top of the shock and trauma of everything your h put you through. People have been put on disability for a lot less than what you’ve gone through in such a short amount of time. I think the kind of thing we go through.. even dealing with just SA alone.. probably often qualifies as a type of breakdown. The paralysis, isolating, and emotional and physical exhaustion.. and the quasi-agoraphobia that you mentioned.. These just aren’t small things that we can shrug off and go pound the pavement looking for a job after having been a housewife and mother for years. How much trauma and sudden change are we supposed to be able to handle when we’re feeling completely depleted? I hope you do decide to go see your doctor, Cindy, and get her in your court. Sending you big hugs. xoxo
Cindy – if you have any money – get YOURSELF to Dr. Minwalla in LA – he is a doctor and can testify and write a report about your complex PTSD. Call him pronto! Beat your husband to the punch. And request that your SAH get evaluated by Dr. Minwalla, too….he does the full psych. evaluation, etc. If you come across an evaluator who doesn’t understand this stuff – then you might be screwed. You will feel so validated by Dr. Minwalla. Call him and he will do a free telephone call to tell you if he can help you. (I bet he can). Please do this…
As a Type A, did my undergrad degree in 3 years at a top university, got my master’s and worked at top companies around the world, survivor of a physically abusive husband, multi-tasker mom of 4 kids within 20 months – and an accomplished person who never sits still and earned good money before and after triplets and still managed to be on the PTA board, and have a part-time job on top of that, and a breast cancer survivor – I have to say, that the SA staggered disclosure, minimization, gas lighting, etc. is the WORST thing that has ever happened to me. I have tried to work my part-time job and I’m not firing on all cyclinders – I have a hard time concentrating, focusing and am worried that if and when I find a full-time job, that I won’t be able to perform. I figured out this SA stuff in Nov. of last year and it has crippled me.
I was just wondering today – how many of you worked through this stuff ?? – did you do OK? and if not, how long did it take you to be able to work effectively? Now that my SAH is on disability, I have to get a job and I’m worried that I won’t do a good job. There are some times when I get a spurt, but most times I feel like I’m underwater.
Deb
Victoria, Thanks for answering. I am afraid that my PTSD symptoms will be twisted into something that might fit STBX’s charge of “mentally unstable.” I have no faith now that I have seen my son’s psych eval.- “tests show no evidence of x,y, or z.” Then under diagnosis- “x,y, and z”. Seems like they put whatever they want.
I can’t imagine trying to work with this stuff. I still can’t read a newspaper a recipe or follow a recipe. I have to check the package like 4 times before I can remember how long to cook the frozen chicken. If my job was gathering evidence for divorce case, however, I would be okay. Seems like that’s all I can focus on.
Hey, what are your agoraphobia symptoms, Cindy? I have some symptoms that I think might fall under that category.
It does sound like you are going to have to fight back if you want what you are owed. It sucks that these guys treat us so horribly during our marriages and then want to just throw us out like yesterday’s trash. And I know fighting is probably the last thing you want to do right now.
Deb, Dr. Minwalla will actually diagnose complex PTSD in spouses of sex addicts? I would think insurance would not cover it and that it would be pulled apart in court, but what do I know?
The person that does an evaluation has to be accepted by both lawyers. I wonder if they would use someone out of town. If they would, that would be great to use someone who is knowledgeable.
My agoraphobia symptoms are related to my not feeling safe anywhere but my home. It is so hard for me to get out. I feel so panicky when I go somewhere. I think it is because I don’t trust anybody right now. I don’t know what is real and not real. I worry that I don’t know the difference sometimes. I know that kind of makes me sound like a psycho. But it is kind of where I am at. What is real? And than I have this paranoid feeling like everyone is against me. Like somehow they are all secretly working in his corner. I mean like, intellectually I know that is not true, but emotionally my body reacts to these things. My heart races, I get really dizzy, I can’t breath and I feel like my skin is being peeled off of me. I really, really don’t want to feel this way. But the more I try to stop these feelings, it is almost like the more intense they become.
Are you all ready to vote me off the island now?????
I am really am normal person, really!!! underneath all of this weird bullshit.
Where am I?????????
No one gets voted off the SA Spouse Survivor Island…when you feel strong enough, you run across the bridge with our blessing. We’re all here to heal and to help until we’re Strong Enough (one of my favorite Cher songs) to leave the island alone.
I would let it leak to a grapevine his new girlfriend is on that you wete so tired of all the STD’s and you were afraid of HIV, that’s why you ginally divorced him.
Helen – I LOVE it! Definitely throw that in the rumor mill. You have to scare the shit out of this guy.
Cindy, if you’re psycho, then so am I. Because I don’t like to leave my house either, and have become set in a rather bizarre old lady mode, preferring to curl up with my kitties, talking away to them, and focusing on the most basic and ordinary things that there aren’t any unknowns about. On the things that are what they are, like my kitties, or listening to the little boy next door playing outside, or staring at a picture of a restful landscape. There’s an instinctive need to feel safe after having our world thrown upside down. Because when the person we shared our life with and trusted implicitly turns out to be a polar opposite of who we thought we knew, then how can we help but ask, ‘What else that I was so sure about is wrong?’ This changes our world view and I really hope it isn’t permanent, because it sucks. And the panic attacks you’re having.. Do you have a prescription for sedatives? I know they’re a mixed blessing because they can be so addictive, but what you’re going through right now is more than any human being can be expected to deal with on their own. Sending you much love and prayers for your healing. xoxo
Cindy,
I dont’ like to leave my house and go out in our community either (never know which of the hundreds of people you will run into). I also hate to be home (where I have the feeling he is spying on me- Recent evidence suggests I may be right). It’s only when I leave town that I start to feel better.
I can’t get through the grocery store without crying and getting really tense. Not quite a panic attack but definitely in the same family.
It sounds like maybe you just have a stronger case of what ails many of us.
If I told any of this to a psychiatrist, goodness knows what they’d decide I had! It really is tragic that we are so in need of support and so not understood.
At least we have each other to reassure us that we are not going crazy, and Cindy, you don’t sound crazy at all to me.
OMG -that is all I can say about the competency test. OMG. He should have to take it too.
Agoraphobia – I have it too. I go to work and that’s it. I never go anywhere. I do go out with my kids but if they are with their dad, I stay home. I feel just as “crazy”. I am paranoid. Absolutely paranoid of men especially. I am so afraid of them that I cannot join a dating website because they may actually answer my ad. I cannot trust ANYONE. While ago a police officer told me that is how many of them end up. They hear so many lies from people that they never trust anyone.
Last week I went to have a pedicure. (All the advice on this site kept ringing in my head: “Take care of yourself. Make it your priority”.) The lady gave me a reflexology massage and found a sore spot in the middle of my foot. It hurt soooo goood. When I got home, I took a 2 hour nap. Next day I had a nap. Day after I slept for 12 hours, and the day after that for 10 hours. I felt sooo good. She really did something to me with that massage!
Of course I had to look it up and the point on my foot is connected to kidney meridian which is about fear, and paranoia!!! I started to study more about reflexology and the kidney meridian and OMG!!! It all makes sense! All my medical issues. It even explains why it feels like I am going deaf! All the physical symptoms are from longterm fear, inability to trust, paranoia… all our emotions will manifest in our body sooner or later.
I am going to give the TCM/reflexology/acupuncture a try. One of the meditations really touched me. It talked about treating yourself (or a fearful person) like a little scared child. That is how I feel. Inside me is a little girl with pigtails, sucking her thumb and holding a teddy bear. Weird. Sometimes when I cry I even do the “dry heaving” like the kids do. The sobs that go on even after the crying is done. Weird.
Don’t think you are psycho. Just traumatized. You can, and you will heal. We all will.
<3 <3 <3
I have never had an anxiety disorder and I was a bloody zombie for years. I only feel like I am coming back to the land of the living in the last few months. It is a terrible blow to the psyche to wake up one day and learn you have NO IDEA who you married! Time is a healer and space from them is a better one, BUT it is a long and lonely road to recover from this, I think. All the symptoms you girls describe are what happens when you are psychologically overwhelmed. Its all just too much to bear . Karen xx
Anna-Lise, the image you evoked about the little girl and the teddy bear, and the sobbing, was so poignant. I just want to give you a big hug. xoxo
anniem: I try to use that image in my healing even if it is so strange to me. I have never wanted to admit I was victim. I am pretty tomboy, hardcore, badass “a female schauvinist”??. Yet, now I feel I am finally old enough to admit I am a girl. I just wanna be held… fo’ real.
Anybody wanna make fun of that? Meet me at the parking lot after school. You and me!
Thank you all for not kicking me off the island. It helps me to know that others are having some of these symptoms too. Misery loves company, but I am sad that so many of us experience this. Do any of you have this problem as well?
Guilt!!!
Guilt for feeling this way? I know that people have so many different things that bring them pain, and I think I have shame for wallowing in this misery. I think I read somewhere that when you get tired of smelling yourself from sitting in your shit, than you go to the hose and rinse off. I think my friends and family have had enough of the odor reeking from my shit stained clothes. They are pleading with me to use the hose.
Damn hose@!!!!!! I think I get up and rinse off and SA throws more shit my way. Ok, maybe I just need to stay under the water. I am trying to aim the damn hose at him and looking forward to the day that the pressure wipes him away.Forget about the stink and the hose. Just walk away. Walk away. Walk away. Find temporary shelter until you are strong enough to take care of yourself.
I blamed myself for most of the time. HOW COULD I HAVE BEEN SO STUPID? What if I had been more flexible, more rad, more sexy, more open-minded? Well, there is no way you could have been more accomodating!!
Why didn’t I check his bank account? Why didn’t I ask for physical proof as in “black on white’ piece of paper to tell me how the money was? Well, I did! And I got a sticky note with a number that was what I wanted it to be.
We got duped by the best. My ex worked for the President’s helicopter squadron as a fiscal accountant. A prestigious command for the Marines of the United States of America. Because he graduated top of his class in the military. Because the freakazoid can calculate the fucking end of the world in his fucking head with the accuracy of the fucking 60 000 fucking fiscal accountants in this fucking country!!!
I am sorry for my language. But I am so angry about the shit that gets smeared on us when it is THEIR fucking fault!!! When they spent every waking moment thinking about how they could deceive us. THAT IS WHY WE GOT DUPED! Not because we are stupid, but because someone put sooooo much energy into lying to their spouse.
Boy, do I feel special!!
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