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What a waste of $170. I didn’t speak much – my SAH just babbled on about how he has to be in control of his recovery and anything I ask for, he doesn’t want to do because I remind him of his mother – and how he now realizes he has a “woman problem” and he’ll never do it again and will figure out how to control it on his own. Great, I said – no problem. I said that I will wait and see. I said that I was going to work on a list of boundaries (e.g. I won’t tolerated lying and if he does, then xxx, I won’t tolerate relationships of any kind with other women or xxx, etc.).
Then our therapist took out an exercise for us to work on – 10 things that we think our spouses would appreciate, and 10 things that we would appreciate if our partner did them for us. The therapist then said (hold onto your seats, sisters:…) “This will be good Deb, because if you know what Anton appreciates, then maybe he won’t look for it elsewhere”.
OMG: If looks could kill, I would have killed the therapist on the spot. What an idiot! Like what I did or didn’t do caused him to have 4 affairs, troll CL ads and porn, and screw 10+ pros? What he said was like….well, Deb, if you just give him enough beer at home, he wouldn’t go out and drink and get a DUI every week.
I’m never going back there again. What a waste of hard earned money.
So…..I guess here’s my list of things that I would appreciate from my husband:
1) I would appreciate if you don’t go to hookers, or have affairs.
2) I would appreciate if you donn’t lie about going to hookers and having affairs.
3) I would appreciate if you don’t blame me for going to hookers and having affairs, or tell me that I’m crazy that I’m upset that you went to hookers and had affairs….(You get the drift).
What a waste of time. Without sobriety and recovery, there is nothing to appreciate in our marriage, except maybe his paycheck.
Deb
Dear Deb
I am so sorry. I can’t believe the therapist said that I really can’t.
Is this a CSAT or marriage family therapist? typical marriage counslers are useless here. I feel like the best counsel I have received so far has been from a chemical dependency addiction clinic counsler. any reference to “the wife” as the problem was not tolerated. addicts must own the behavior. no psycho babble excuses. just own what you did. because you are an addict. or an ahole, whichever your school of thought. or both.
well appreciate the paycheck. I guess that’s something.
just remember, we can still get a paycheck from them, without the man/addict to live with. It’s called alimony and child support. just a friendly reminder.Hi Deb,
Ohh that is so sad. But the plus is atleast you know that this answer is BS. There are many women who would have felt, yeah their the expert i will try because yet it again it must be me…Wow. So sorry. But now you know never to go back!!!Love,
FloraI have said it over and over……..
This is why marriage counseling will not work until the issues of infidelity, internet porn use with masturbation instead of loving intimacy and compulsive sexual behaviors are addressed.
Marriage counselors have one goal, to save the marriage. They will try to distribute the blame equally, ask each partner to compromise and then show them how to make ‘nicey nicey’.
Marriage counseling has no place in a relationship that has been destroyed by Sex Addiction. All it will do is traumatize the partner even more than she already has been.
Broken Record here………Do not go to marriage counseling before the compulsive sexual behavior issues are fixed.
Broken Record here……………You cannot heal a marriage before the compulsive sexual behavior issues are fixed.
Dear Deb,
So very sorry. Ugh! I can imagine how frustrating that was. It just makes me sick how outrageous and clueless some of these “professionals” are!
How about this one:
“Id appreciate it if you’d cut your dick off.”
Hugs to you.
~BonnieI’d appreciate it if you’d cut your dick off.
Another pillow saying!
We need to copyright these things.
Oh, I forgot, they already are as soon as they are written.
We just need a ballsy old woman’s cross stitch group to make them up for us.
Oh dear God, Deb… that therapist list..”won’t look for it elsewhere??” Paging Rod Serling.. God, I am so sorry. xoxo
Hi all,
Here’s what I just emailed our marriage therapist, Tim….I’m being kind (although I want to rage) – Tim Stein and Brigitte are CSATs. Let’s hope they chime in…
Tim,
Thanks for our marriage therapy session today.
I’m not sure, though, that it was that helpful. It would seem that until Anton’s compulsive sexual behavior and recovery is well under control – there isn’t much marriage building that can take place. Our resources are not limitless so I want to be sure to put our time and $$ where it will be most useful right now.
At this point, Anton seems to be most focused on gaining control due to his mother issues and as he describes himself – by being “a petulant teenager”.
I was also surprised when you said today that it would be helpful for me to figure out what makes Anton feel appreciated with the list exercise so he wouldn’t go elsewhere to fulfill his needs. His acting out behavior is either an addiction and/or a personality disorder, so anything that I may do will have little to no effect on that. It seems like we are putting the cart before the horse with an exercise like this, but please tell me the purpose at this stage?
I’d like to get Tim Stein and Brigitte’s opinion on this….Tim or Brigitte – can you please chime in? In your opinion, is it worthwhile to do marriage therapy in the beginning stages of recovery? And if so, what should the focus be on?
Thanks.
Deb
Yeah – this guy is clearly out of his element and just collecting a check.
Here’s what Tim, the CSAT responded:
I do not do couples therapy with someone who is active in their addiction.
I find it unproductive. I realize there is some lack of clarity regarding
Anton and whether or not his behavior stems from an addiction.Oh Deb! I know I haven’t been here long, and I’m still catching up on all the stories… but ((hug)) I think that you definitely shouldn’t be working on the marriage right now. He needs to work on his issues. And you need to work on you!
Maybe at some point, you can work on you as a couple, but until he mans up and works on his shit, you’ll just be spinning your wheels (and paying for that therapist’s new wheels!)
Hopefully your CSATs pipe up!
JoAnn-Steve’s counselor continued to try and save the marriage, although we spent most of the time talking about Steve and what he should do to make it work. ie: stop lieing. I think the counselor spent 5 sessions telling Steve to stop lieing-well, it never happened. I think the reason why the counselor was spending so much time on “US” is because he is a Christian counselor and will try and reconcile the marriage 1st.
I agree – It is an bass ackward way to approach things. The addiction needs to be dealt with 1st. How can a marriage be saved when the addiction is still going on.Deb, it’s frustrating to see you so frustrated by things we’ve been saying will only frustrate you. How many times have women here, further along in it, said NO COUPLE’S COUNSELING? And why waste time writing the idiot counselor? He’s a moron not worth your energy. It’s time for some action here. Don’t you agree?
Oh, and he was extremely condescending, that therapist, in his response: “I realize there is some lack of clarity…” Fucker.
Sometimes I wish JoAnn would just get to the point and say how she really feels! Just kidding, JoAnn, Love you! 🙂
ClaireOMG I would be up for homicide of someone. Is incredible we PAY $$ to be told this shit. I can think of nothing else productive to say. I love you, Deb. F–k the lot of them.
God Bless, Karen xxThe DUI analogy is a great one.
Tell the therapist that you’re husband gives you that kind of BS for free so you don’t need to pay $170 for it.
You posted in another post that your H finally admitted he was an addict. But now he has it all under control again which is the same ole song you heard when he was denying being an addict. I can’t help but be suspicious and think that perhaps he only “admitted” to being an addict so you’d stop insisting he was. Bluntly… to shut you up.
I’ve admitted to things I didn’t even do in order to get people off my back. My attitude was “ok… ok… you’re right… can we move on now?’ That is not meant to defend him one bit but rather for you to consider you’re getting the same BS I’ve given to others.
As for his “mother issues”… somebody needs to remind him that he is a grown man… that shit is in the past… and HERE in the present he has WIFE issues.
Thanks all. I only went to the marriage counselor today because he was closing in on my SAH and asked for a release to talk to the CSAT that he saw twice. But – that went nowhere. Of course, my SAH thought it was a fantastic session because he felt like he had “control” although he did agree that the comment about the appreciation list and me learning how to prevent him from getting other things was really bogus.
I will not go back to that counselor ever again….that comment has me reeling and wanting to ask for my $$ back. This is also the guy that sat back and watched my husband disclose throughout the course of the year, without blinking an eye or referring him on.
Yes – you all told me – and I was frustrated, as predicted. At least now I can see how ludicrous it was.
March, I know it’s confusing but Tim West is our soon to be ex-marriage counselor and Tim Stein is the CSAT that we saw. Tim Stein, the CSAT, is the one that wrote above that if he is an addict (he doesn’t really know since my SAH didn’t want to go back to him) – and is an active addict, then it doesn’t make sense to do marriage counseling.
Deb
Dr. Liza prescribes that you take the $170 and buy a really really cute Coach clutch purse STAT. Then you will have somewhere to put all the cash you’ll be saving on couples’ counseling.
I second the motion.
Deb, I understand that you are still hoping that someone will take your side, believe your truth, and confirm you are right about what’s going on. But they won’t. Dr. Minwalla did as much of that as you are going to get. The power lies within you, to believe your truth, take your own side, no matter what these idiots say or email. There is no solution in the place you are looking for it (okay that was a bad sentence—March—fix that). The solution is within you. It really is. You have what you need. You ARE what you need. Every little step you take into those truths, will lead you out of this nightmare.
Big flashlight
D.xoDear Deb,
I love all the posts, and find Diane’s especially helpful. You know Deb, in the early months after D day, I wanted justification sooooo bad. I actually got some from our marriage therapist. H admitted he was an addict to her. She is a supporter of trauma model. Not codi. but informed us this was really beyond her scope. but she was helpful to me. was even going to recommend I go out on disability for PTSD. I never did. but she was good.
But the answers really do lie within ourselves. And it’s like we keep searching for a therapist, an intensive, a church a something, an anything, that will support what we know to be true.
It is so sad, that there is not a place (besides here) that validates the truth of the partner. In many ways, we are our only witness’. We have to trust ourselves and we have experienced enough, to seek no further validation than that sometimes. The fact that we know what happened, and what is really going on, is honestly all we need. Many of the answers do lie within. There’s a tiger inside Deb. She is stronger than you will ever know. Let her free– she’s not afraid to do what is necessary to make your life better. communicating with our inner selves, is powerful indeed.
Or a therapist, an ntensive, a chiurch, a something, an anything who will convince we are wrong because the truth really sucks so you want affirmation of your denail.
I think many partners run to therapists in the hope thye will somehow MAKE the husband see what they( the wife ) have failed to make them see? They want support and thye want to be able to impact their husbands? If these therapists would just say “He is nuts and unlikely to change in any appreciable way” it would save ALL of us alot of time and money? I actually had a shrink (not the addictions specialist)say as much to me. He said that expecting much change in someone who has lived with certain behaviors for 53 years is grasping at straws. That made sense to me…it isn’t rocket science? He must have believed in sex addiction because he is the one who referred my husband to the other psychiatrist. Just the same…he didn’t think there was any hope for much change and neither did I. As I have said before…maybe with age ect they may lose the sexual behavior (maybe!) but they will still have all the other looney traits.They are NOT normal. Karen xx
Hi Kim, Karen, Pam, Diane et. al,
I really do think that my SAH is nuts. I’m not looking for anyone to say that he isn’t. I just want to know what’s operating here – as I might make different decisions if I knew.
For instance, my therapist today said that she thinks there is something really wrong with my SAH’s “executive reasoning” function and that she can understand why my SAH’s therapist wants him to get a neuropsych. test on top of the MRI (which he was set to do today but he cancelled).
Yeah – I’d say that all of our SAH’s have “executive reasoning” issues – don’t ya think? LOL.
I would really LOVE a diagnosis and treatment plan – but if I ask for one – then I’m just being his “controlling mom”. Geeezzz…I already have four kids – don’t need another one. I actually cried in therapy today because I realize that I’m a single mom with FIVE kids – one with ADD and a teacher who is a bully, one with depression/rage issues (likely bi-polar), one who is being gay bashed – and then my SAH who changes like the wind and likes to screw grannies.
I really feel a lot of pressure and trying to keep my head above water. I guess the good news is that there is one child that I can kick out of the house as he is over the age of 18. Yes, I know the answer resides with me, but I really would LOVE a diagnosis (beyond he’s “nuts”) – somehow I think that would make things much clearer.
Thanks all.
Deb
Sister Deb, I feel so very sad when I read your posts. It reminds me so much of that scene in the Wizard Of Oz when Dorothy asks Glinda the Good Witch how to get back to Kansas. And Glinda tells Dorothy, “My dear, you’ve always had the power.” I know you crave the validation of others, but please believe that you, and only YOU, ultimately know what is best for you and your children. Trust yourself. Said with Love, Liza
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