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I had to go to a parenting class as part of the divorce proceedings. It is court ordered in our state that anyone who is getting divorced or share a child dealing with custody issues/or seperation must attend. But the class was a little sad it talks about how the kids are affected and what you can do to lessen the blow to them. It is all so sad, especially when I did not want this, tried my best and I was not the cause of the breakdown. But nevertheless its sad. But one of the main things that many of the kids were sad about was the parents yelling, even if it was in the middle of the night, they hear it. So I hope for everyone they are able to avoid that type of environment if kids are in the house if you are deciding to stay with your spouse. Because as bad as divorce can be, a turbulent envrinoment is worse. But even though I have filed, there is still sorrow, i don’t think it will ever end. Sorry this did not work.
I am wondering though where is the parenting class where they deal with mentally ill or addicted parents?? Its not a level playing field dealing in the situation.
Then to learn the stats that about 50% first marriages end in divorce, 67% of second marriages, and 74% of third marriages. Great. There really is no hope, not to mention that I am sure if I tell any man that I have been married and divorced twice … they will run for the hills. feel like I am damaged goods.
Just a hard day. Feel bad for the kids, feel bad for the situation. Oh well. Luckily tomorrow is another day.
Hi Flora,
Also going through the process of divorce and I can honestly say I have never felt this kind of pain before. Its in my gut then travels to my heart. Mornings seem to be the worst for me. I can understand your concern about the children. I can see it in my daughters eyes, just very sad. I too have really bad days and then okay days. I think we are grieving which I hate but is necessary…Thinking of you Flora and hope you feel better soon. Love, NAPHi Flora and NAP – Divorce, to me, is worse than a death. “They” are still here. Both of you stay strong – it is a pain like you have never felt before, and hopefully will never feel again.
But please feel joy when you think of the kids – you are doing what is best for them, and that is what counts. I don’t remember how old your’e kids are, and I know they are sad, but someday when they are old enough to understand they will know it was best for them as well. They will have nothing but respect for you for having the courage to rescue all of you from a life that could only hurt you all the more in the long run. I have three grown sons, and all three of them have told me they are so glad I made the decision to leave they’re father. Two of them were out of the house, and the third a Junior in highschool. When I told him of my decision, he couldn’t get packed quick enough to get out of there! They also know in they’re hearts that I stayed as long as I did to keep the family structure together – well knowing I could not have raised all three of them on my own, and working nights as an R.N. Your’e kids will feel the same way after they are out of the environment they are in, and see what it is like to live “Normal.” Again, I guarantee they will have nothing but empathy for what you have gone through, and respect for having the strength to make the decision you have.
You guys are making the right decision – hang in there, it will get better. After reading your post’s, it is evident you are both very strong women. Please know that my prayers are with you.Awwww…. My heart is so heavy for you, me, THEM, the innocent children, all of us! Sigh!! And especially like Flora said…. We didn’t ask for this!! Not for one second of this! We were good, loving wives and Mothers! In fact, this is ridiculous! My heart just aches for especially Flora since it is obvious that today was such a hard day! And honey, I’m with you, I will be divorced twice as well when I finally get the nerve to do it! And I have felt the same way! But….let them run for the hills!!! Who needs them anyway?? I, for one, have no interest in the opposite sex at the moment. Not even for my lawyer, doctors, therapist, etc. No men aloud! I’m over it right now! Ugh! If there was a gay bone in my body, I swear I would actually consider it…lol… But trust me, there’s not!!! And really, deep down, I love men, I really do! I have the best Dad ever, 3 wonderful brothers, an awesome 22 yr old son, etc. But right now, “boys” are a bad word! At least all if the men in our lives!!!
Anyway…. Thinking of you all, while sitting here with stupid SA, pretending to watch a movie!! Lol… Keep chins up!!! XO!Sorry for all the typo’s! (I know you spell it ‘allowed’) I am just a little off my rocker tonight! (playing on my phone during the movie) ha! Would rather be sitting around a table any day talking to all of YOU instead!! 🙂
As the product of a divorce from a narcissistic abusive father– and I realize now… an addictive sort who had other women…
divorce is a BLESSING!!! It was the bravest most wonderful gift my mother ever gave me and for that one thing alone, I will be eternally grateful. Of course, I turned out to be a complete nut job… lol… but it would’ve been 1000 times worse, if she had stayed. If only she had left like 10 years sooner!!!My older son has TONS of friends (he’s nearly 21- scary) from divorced homes and they are all terrific kids!
I hate the term “broken.”
“Broken” is what you currently have!!!
If it is the right thing for you, it is right for them too. Yeah… the parenting class sounds pretty rote. One size does not fit all.
I would always opt for private family therapy, to work out issues.
Hi all. You might want to throw something at me, but… my husbands therapist said that he would rather be me than him (SA) because of the huge burden of guilt and shame that he will always carry. I wanted to tell him to drop dead. He should try feeling what I’m feeling. I kind of understand though, when I read about what you are going through in the divorce process and worrying about the effects on your families. Can you imagine knowing that you did this to your precious family? You WILL come out the other side and find joy, but I will pray for you to find comfort during the process.
Excellent points Lylo. These men have to be in recovery to be at the point where they are able to understand their role in the process and what they are doing to their family. The reason these divorces are happening is because they aren’t in recovery and doesn’t look like they will be anytime soon, in spite of time and love and patience on the part of their wife…..these men can’t possibly understand, their head is too full of their addiction and all the things that go with it…denial, justification, minimization, blame, rationalization.
MarieYes Lylo and Marie,
It was sad. And to sit there and get the feeling that it is your fault, would be hard. But for some of them I am not sure they even see it as there fault. Hence like you said non-recovering addicts, and non-recovering addicts will probably breeze through a class, while we hang our heads in disapointment. They probably say to themselves when is this class over i go things to do!There in lies the huge difference, I can;t wait anymore. And have decided to split. Its hard, I had always hoped for the best. And after a day like yesterday, still hoped for that turn around by him; but he is so clueless and in his own world. I am not sure if he has ever stepped out of it and joined me looing back. And that is what I want in my life and active participant or no one.
And I may never meet that someone, I too and really over men and more so the relationship part. But the class also showed happy families together, ugh, i do wish for that always have. I thought that was what i was headed for with the SA; the addiction was like getting hit by a truck. Really blindsided.
Hi all,
I wish my husband was not a SA. I wish my husband was in recovery and getting all the help he needs. I wish I had the man without the addiction and what goes along with it. I love my husband with my heart and soul. Divorce is painful however it is necessary for me to be able to live a healthy life. Im looking forward to my personal growth and try to see my life ahead of me as an adventure. I think we should feel good about ourselves because we really gave it our all. I know what the power of love can do. I realize I cant love my husband out of his addiction. I have to love myself and if youre like me…havent done that in a long time.NAP,
Yes I realized as well. All i can do is remove myself from the situation. Its the best I can do.Thank you for all of your support. Hugs.
FloraLast contact with my attorney made it sound like they (he and his attorney) wanted to get this over quickly and that the house was not a question.
Arrived home today with two letters from the attorney. both requested documents. The first few things were standard items: tax returns, W-2’s, 401 K statements, bank statements, – the one I was not prepared for was appraisal of the house. Second letter is an answer to the plaintiffs complaint; where they cross complaint – and note dissolution of marriage, joint legal custody, parenting schedule, allocation of debt, fair and equitable property settlement, and such further releif as the court may deem equitable.
unf. i got home after five and could not reach my attorney. I was hoping I could have my house and get through this as intact a possible but now I am really worried. Does anyone know if this is normal, or does it appear my lazy ass husband is trying to take half of what I worked hard to get while he sat at home and viewed porn on the computer all day.
Any info anyones has is greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Hi Flora,
If you live in a 50-50 no fault community property state like I do, any assets (including property) that was aquired during the marriage is split 50-50. If you owned your home prior to the marriage, have only your name on the title, and it was never co-mingled in any way, I dont think he will get half of the value of the home. Im not totally sure, however, its my best understanding. If the mortgage is in both your names and he contributed to payments, then that may be considered co mingled. These are my thoughts but not exactly sure. Do you live in a 50-50 no fault state?Yes it is pretty much that and it gets worse. Because my SA husband made no money his dad co-signed on the loan, so it is three of us. So never mind the fact that I put the 20% down from the sale of my condo and made the monthly payments, does not seem to matter. Does not seem to matter that he refused to work, nor make anymoney to contribute to the household in a worthwhile way, its still half his. I hope that this is standard, but I am really worried that he will get this even though I feel that he committed fraud. He was completely fraudulant in the way he acted and contributed in the marriage. I never would have married him had I known i was going to have to pay for everything forever by myself and not only that that he is a liar.
I am just so upset and ticked. I hope its all a bad dream. I hope the attorney calls and has something good to say tomorrow. Otherwise I just may have to give up the house if they take all my savings, give me half the debt and then also have to pay him 50% equity on the house. Because I don;t have it. I don;t know where I would go with three kids and two dogs. I would not be able to rent or I will have to get rid of my dogs. And then they will wipe me out savings wise, i will not have even anymoney for a deposit on a rental, not that I could rent anywhere with two dogs. Can’t afford to buy as I have no money to put down on a purchase.
Thank NAP for writing. I hope it gets better tomorrow.
Hi Flora,
So sorry to hear your news. Even though its a 50-50 no fault state you maybe able to negotiate some type of settlement which would make up for that lost revenue. If you can think of a good carrot for him, he may accept the terms of the divorce, so you wont have to lose the house. It may be to get the 20% down payment and he gets Christmas every year something like that. As long as its a win-win and both parties are in agreement, the 50-50 can be negotiated. Youll need to think of something that would give you good leverage! Also, helps to have a good lawyer.Also, make sure he has to pay child support til your daughter is 18. Poor AH may have to get a job to pay it but he is responsible since she will be living with you. Make sure your lawyer gets this for you! (this is true even if there is joint custody)
My bulldog (female) attorney told ME, that even though Indiana is 50/50 (no fault), there ARE exceptions….. And she whole heartedly considered my story/scenario an exception! And, we haven’t even begun to do the work….. (because of course I haven’t filed yet and SA doesn’t even KNOW yet, but she said we will come up with what WE want to ask for…. like 70/30 or 60/40….. or he takes all the debt or WHATEVER…. because I didn’t ask for this and I don’t deserve this….. I will also be portrayed (except it’s NOT an act) as the victim….. suddenly on antidepressants, going to a therapist for my trauma, etc.
I think the exception in my case though is – since I have been obsessingly watching every move for months…. AND (hee hee), I know for a FACT, that he sits at work every day for HOURS at a time (yes, while they pay him 90 grand to run the place)…. and is on BBPeople meet, his “secret” yahoo account, Tagged (singles site), Friend finder, etc. UGH!! By the way, he has been spending at least 60 bucks a month JUST on the singles sites, not to mention money to wine and dine these bitches, plus gas money to drive to Kingdom Come and back…. depending on what freakin state they live in!! PLUS THE HOTEL ROOMS AND WHO THE HELL KNOWS WHAT ELSE…..
Anyway….. he uses his WORK LAPTOP at his desk all day to correspond, AND his company paid cell phone to text, send NASTY pics back and forth, IM, make phone calls, etc. AND, I use to work there for 17 years and I know for a FACT that is a BIG NO NO….. and if/when he gets caught – he is GONE! FIRED!!! And he has been there for 31 years….. yikes….. of all things, never thought he would jeopardize his precious job!!! Just goes to show how sick he is……..ANYWAY, so….. we are going to propose a mediator first – and then hand over our proposal…which will basically give me PRACTICALLY everything, lol…. except the debt… and the reason will be that he has spent all this money all these years on extra marital affairs….. and we know it and he knows it…… if he tries to minimize it and not agree with out proposal…. we will threaten to supeona his “work records” of cell phones and emails in order to investigate exactly how much money he has spent in the last 17 years…….. Personally, I’m banking he will sign at the dotted line and run otherwise…… his job and reputation will be GONE…….
That’s my story, but my point is….. there IS room for negotiation on that 50/50 crap and you need to think long and hard on how to back him into a corner and make him sign!! I’m sure there is plenty of blackmail or SOMETHING!
If you need help brainstorming, private message me your number and I will call you! I will be an expert by the time this whole thing is said and done!!Good luck to you and I can’t wait to see what your attorney says…. Are you happy with your attorney? Why or why not? First things first, you need a KICK ASS attorney!!!
Flora – So sorry this is happening. I agree withsilver-lining.
Therer has to be retribution for everything he has put you through. No-fault divorce can be negotiated. I was lucky with the post-nump, but make sure your’e attorney is a bull-dog! My attorney is female, and doesn’t put up with any crap from these men. IF you are not satisfied with the one you have, by all means get a second opinion. Kansas is a no-fault divorce state, but my girlfriend was told she could “clean” her husband. Depends on the circumstances.
Let us know what you hear.
Love to you.AND WE ALL KNOW THE FREAKING CIRCUMSTANCES…… GO GET HIM SISTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I was hoping this was/is a pitbull attorney. I met with him and one other, she already started talking about giving away this and that, and I don’t want to. I asked her if he would have to pay, due to his lack on contribution, does that count for anything? She said well you married him, and stayed with him for five years?!?!? WTF like I knew he would be this lazy??
Plus a consult alone costs $350 to $400 for each attorney. I already paid for two consults, I can’t afford anymore. so I hired the one that sounded like he would go for the gold medal.
Unf. I don;t have a ton of evidence like silver, don’t really have much at all. I have been an open book, but I do think there is a possibility that his parents are sheltering inheritence that is his, alhtouhg it is in their accounts. I could try that, petition the wills of the granparents that died. Because I never saw them, and his mother frequently doles out “grandma” money to him. she makes it sound like she is sharing money she inherited, but its possible that it is actually his and they have been hiding stuff from me all along. It may be possible that he also has some stocks for him which are in his parents name from his grandfather. Some were cashed in when i was on bedrest to make up for my lost income, as SA did not make enough to cover much of anything.
I am just so angry that being the responsible one and making sure the bills get paid and we have a house to live in, gets me nothing. That being a complete lazy ass gets you half of nothing of which you participated in or earned. Boy does being lazy really pay off for him. Meanwhile he lives with his parents for free.
I hate him.
Spoke with my attorney. The attorneys are meeting today at 10:00 a.m. I am to call my attorney at 1;00 to see how it went. So no news yet. The Sa’s attorney says that the SA has been deep into therapy and recovery, blah blah blah. Isn’t amazing how what they do can be all erased becaue they are “deep into therapy”. There are no tests for this. Maybe i should request a lie detector test. Thats the only way to be even close to sure of this all. Unlike with drugs and alchohal you can do tests, nothing for an SA. Its all based on their words. Which mean nothing. Supposedly my SA was deep into therapy when he was caught viewing porn in front of our daughter, he was in therapy then as well.
any advice on anything is greatly appreciated.
Hi Flora,
Im sorry to say but the inheritance hes sheltering would not be available for you. If it was never co-mingled, like adding your name to it, then inherited monies and assets are protected….bummer!You will need to find something that he wants and then use it as leverage. If you have the computer he used for his pornography viewing I think there are ways to retrieve it still. This could create a custody stir with your daughter. I really dont know Im just trying to think of ways to help you. Just remember he needs to pay you child support!!!!
PS. If he does have inheritence that is providing income that would be a significant fact for you.
This enrages me so much Flora. Can you GET evidence? Do you know his haunts? Can you bait him? That would blow his entire “recovery” claim outta the water and nothing would give me more joy than to see him go down. I hope your lawyer is out for blood. SA deserves to be rendered penniless. idiot.
I know its painful, to have to stoop down to his low level… I will even help if there’s anything I can do. Unfortunately, I’m really, really good at it. 🙁
BTW, I read earlier and please don’t feel like you are branded. You are not in the 75%. You are in the upper 5%–AT LEAST!!! The people who fail time after time are those who just blindly keep makin the same mistakes over and over again, and that is not you at all!!!!!!!
My mom divorced my loser addict narcissistic sicko father and then fell in love remarried the love of her life (my wonderful step father who showed me that a man could be truly good and kind) and was blissfully happy with him (and he with her) for over 30 years until the day he died 10 years ago.
Please don’t lose hope.
much love and strength,
Lexie
Flora- You can request him to take a lie detector test, but remember my husband beat it. They have been living a life of lieing for so long that they either believe they’re lies or don’t feel guilty about the addiction. Of course, if he refuses, that certainly indicates guilt.
Remember, you can supoena mental health records from his therapist and use them in court. Or, you can even have her testify as to his mental instability. She/he would have to disclose.
If he has an inheritance, but not in your’e name, it is still income for him, (assets) and I would think he would have to have that included in assets that in turn would determine what you can get for a settlement/alimony if you are going after that. I may be wrong on that, but just trying to throw some things out there to think about.
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