Sweet JoAnn, why do you stay with Larry?

b-trayed, thanks for asking the question as I’m sure many of the other Sisters may have wondered the same thing.

I did write a post on the married site about this, but I will be happy to extend my thoughts about my decision even further here, as I do think that brutal honesty, both with ourselves and with others, is the only way to achieve peace and contentment in our lives with the choices that we make.

We cannot make good choices in our lives without a lot of introspection, self awareness and, most of all, by being completely honest with ourselves about who we are and what we want.

I have, and still do, spend a lot of time evaluating my life situations. I am constantly weighing the pros and cons of my decisions (in all areas of my life–not just about Larry) and I think we all have to decide what we want and what it will cost us to get what we want.

As all of you may know I am retired and so is Larry. We each have a retirement income that is better than most retirees. I have a nice house with some equity as well as some investments. Larry does not have those things but he has a government pension, an annuity pension and an Air Force disability pension.

I only point that out so all of you know that either one of us could get along just fine alone if we chose to do that. We both stay together because we want to, not because we have to.

So, why do I stay with this Sex Addicted man/child?

I guess I will have to tell you about my priorities in order for you to understand.

Some of the things that are important to me are a quiet, peaceful existence, a partner who is calm, non-violent and who shares some of my interests. I also need financial security, an excellent relationship with my children and grandchildren and I hope to have continued good health.

I like to travel and I also need my space–and a lot of it, to do my own thing. I need to have the time to write and paint, read and get my hands dirty in mother earth’s soil. I love flowers, trees and a sense of connection and communion with all things natural. I need to be able to always pursue learning new things, whether that is mastering computer geeky software or learning how to use a scroll saw.

I try to always keep an open mind, to listen to viewpoints that are different or opposite of my own, because that is how we learn. I strive for tolerance of everything and everyone and constantly have to chastise myself for being critical of others.

So, knowing all that, and if you knew Larry, you would know why I stay with him. We have a deeply satisfying emotional connection. He is kind, soft spoken, has no temper and shares my interests. We travel beautifully together and he loves my children and grandchildren. Probably one of the most important gifts that he gives me is my space. He supports anything that i wish to do, no matter how goofy, and he never even asks the cost. If I want to work on the computer until 1am for weeks at a time, he never complains.

We have exactly the life that I always dreamed of. He is nice to have around, is a great snuggler and I truly enjoy being with him.

But, he is a Sex Addict. His childhood was a nightmare and I know that I can never, ever fully expect him to be completely honest with me. He has his demons and he is battling them furiously. He wants to change with his entire being, but nature and nurture are against that. The best I can hope for is longer and longer periods of sobriety between the slips.

So, how important is the SA piece to me? I know that i can live with the fact that he suffers from a serious addiction problem. I realize Sex Addiction is connected with the very core of my relationship, it encompasses all that makes me emotionally secure and it does have the potential to devastate me and our relationship.

But I also understand the reasons behind his illness and I know that i can live with it as long as I see his continued commitment to recovery. I know there will be slips and I am acutely aware of the toll they will take on me.

I tell myself that my bottom line boundary is that if he ever slipped far enough to seek out sex with another person, then I would call it quits. At least I think I would. But, there is a nagging little doubt about my ability to enforce that consequence. Here is why I have a secret doubt about that boundary.

It’s all about the ‘F’ word.

NO–not that.

Finances!

So, even though it is very difficult for me to admit to myself, and even harder for me to write it here, I have to be honest in thinking that I just might stay, even if Larry did cross that line in the future, simply because I would not want to risk my security in my old age.

I know, this goes against everything I believe in, but the thought continues to nag at me.

The extra money from my widow’s benefits would make a huge difference between having either a tight budget or being more secure during the rest of my elderly years.

But, deep inside of me I know that it would probably never go that far. I am able to recognize when Larry is heading down a bad path, and I truly do not believe that he would ever cross that line again.

I guess it is one of my worst fears, so the thought of having to make that decision under those circumstances just haunts me. I can only hope that I never have to.

One thing I do know for certain is that i will always need Larry’s continued commitment to his recovery and i would need to see honest and continued efforts on his part for the rest of our lives. If he ever become an asshole, active addict I would leave in a minute without a second thought.

Oh, and there is one more thing, and I think it is most important. After all is said and done, I do deeply love Larry and I know he loves me.

So, I guess the bottom line is that each and every one of us makes our choices for so many varied and complex reasons. And, as long as we make those decisions with full knowledge of our own wants and needs; if we are brutally honest with ourselves and we realize the costs of our decisions either way, emotionally, physically and financially, then those decisions are as right as right can be. And we will always feel at peace with ourselves because we know that we made an informed decision that was right for us.

I guess you can say that that is the reason for my somewhat calm response to Larry’s slip. Sure it hurt, and yes, I was upset. But, deep down I knew that I was in this for the long haul for all the right reasons–MY reasons, and that this too, would pass.

Now, I would also like to hear from my Sisters about how you made the decision to stay or leave. What are your priorities and what are you willing to give up to get what you want?

Sharron, I don’t think that Steve is anywhere near the same place as Larry is in his recovery. From everything you have written about Steve he doesn’t seem to have truly embraced the concept of recovery, and does not have adequate support from his counselor to move forward with it.

I think that’s why you are having such a difficult time making any decisions. I think you know that you really cannot live with Steve the way he is, and you have not really seen any change in him over the past year.

My heart aches every time I read of your pain. You have been in turmoil and pain for so long, and from what you say there has been no change in Steve. I cannot see you living the rest of your life like that. I wish I had some wise words for you, but, hopefully you will find your way with the help of the Sisters.

And, I hope that my brutally honest discourse on my most private thoughts will not be misconstrued as encouraging anyone to stay with a SA just because of the money.

That is not my point at all. I was only giving my very personal insight to encourage everyone to thoroughly search their souls for what they need in life and what they are willing to give up to get it.

All decisions have negative and positive effects. As long as we have fully explored our reasons for our decisions, then we should find a peace and contentment with our choice.

If we continue to feel unhappy, uneasy, unfulfilled or angry, then we have not made the right choice.

Sharron,

99% to stay and 1% to leave? My god woman, those numbers should be reversed!

From what you have written over the last year or so, here’s what I see. Steve has not truly embraced recovery, he continues to lie to you on a regular basis, he continues to objectify women, he acts in a creepy, lecherous manner toward his own daughter and sister and has an very unhealthy relationship with his counselor .

Please correct me if i am wrong on those points.

And, you have suffered so much pain over these things. You have no peace with where Steve is at, like I have with Larry, and you are constantly in turmoil over his hurtful actions. You only have his words that he wants to change, not his actions–and what do we always say? Pay attention to his actions, not his words?

Sure, you have a lot in common, but what about the rest of it? That’s what has been killing you and driving you to drink. How have you justified all that to come to a 99% decision to stay?

I’m just trying to understand. That’s what we are here for, to talk things through and help and support each other.

Please share your thoughts about Steve’s behaviors and how you came to your decision.

Hi all,
I’m really finding this forum quite confusing. Please help me to understand. Boundries have a money clause? I surely understand we each make our own choices in life about what we will and won’t tolerate for whatever the reasons. JoAnn you stated your reasons quite clearly and honestly. Would
I do that or others is free will, a choice.

I think Sharron pretty much too said she is staying for the finances, which is an honest response. I don’t think we can call her out on this. I quess her boundries have a money clause too. It is what it is.

Just remember, sometimes we get what we pay for.

Love, Nap

Very interesting topic. As always, I love the differing viewpoints. JoAnn,  welcome back! I hate how an SA, once again, has a negative impact on what should have been the vacation of a lifetime! I can’t tell you how many holidays and vacations my SA has ruined or at least compromised in the last 17 years. It was always SOMETHING…… 

My reasons for leaving boil down to one (ok, 2) things:

Self respect and self love 

On the surface, I’ve had a great 17 years. I have a beautiful home (inside and out) that we customized and had built during our engagement. It’s not just the material things, or the house itself, it’s the comfy, familiar, safe, place that I call home. Do I want to leave it? Hell no. Do I have to in order to have self respect and self love? Hell yes.

We have an awesome big (live in) boat down on Dale Hollow lake in Tennessee. It is our vacation spot every other weekend, from April through October. We have many wonderful friends down there and it is the most beautiful lake you can imagine. My soul is well when I am there and all my troubles and problems seem to disappear, if only for a few days at a time. It is a nice reprieve and a great place to get revived and energized. Oh, how I will miss it so!! Do I want to give up this essential retreat of mine? Hell no. Must I, in order to have self respect and self love? Hell yes. 

I could continue with this, but I’m sure you get the drift. In order to make an easy transition, figure out what to do next, and save some money in the process, I have chosen to move in with my Dad, in the old family homestead where I grew up (the house that built me), and take a year off most responsibilities and really figure out what I want to do with my life, once and for all. Am I looking forward to being roomies with my 77 year old widowed Dad in his rambling 3 story house!?? Not really. 
One of my friends suggested that it could end up being the best move I ever made. Perhaps she is on to something and I hope she is! I love my Dad, he is the best man I know, by far, and he is happy to have me. Considering the bonding time we will have, it may be the best decision ever. I’m grateful to have the opportunity and again, it is MY choice to move in with him. I am scared shitless about my future and this divorce has been a long time coming. Having a safe place to pass through during the transition is a godsend. Does it sound exciting and attractive!? Um, no. But I’m gonna make it work. Why? Because I have a new found self respect and self love that I am willing to fight for and make sacrifices, no matter the cost. 

I no longer have a “real job” so I am just waitressing and have 0 benefits. Scary? YES!!!! Do I still want to leave anyway? HELL yes!!!! 

I am only speaking for myself, of course, but my wish is for every single one of my sisters to say, enough is enough and I won’t tolerate this heartache for one more minute. I wish you all would run and run FAST for your life. 

Except for the last year or so, my SA was my BFF as well. Soooo much in common, had great conversations, and I couldn’t WAIT to share with him any piece of news about anything in my life!!! Many people loved us as a couple and would have never believed the issues we had behind closed doors. We were living a lie and I knew it, just like many of you KNOW, in your heart of hearts, that this is a very unhealthy and sad way to share your life with someone, no matter what the other good benefits are. 

By my own choices, I consider myself one of the lucky ones. And that’s interesting, considering all the life changes and adjustments this decision has and will cost me. Do I care? Hell no! I’m getting my life back! I am supporting my dream to stay true to myself. Brighter days are ahead and I can’t wait!!! 

I will always support each and every sister during her personal journey through this trainwreck, however, I will never be truly at peace until each and every one reclaims their life back. 

I hate to learn something through someone I care about’s misfortune and heartache… But this so called “slip” of Larry’s (which could have been premeditated) has only further confirmed to me that I am most definitely Making the best decision for myself. And although I admire your maturity, wisdom, grace and compassion, I realize that living with an SA (“recovering” or not) is simply not for me – at any cost! 

Respectfully and with much love, 

Silver Lining

Wow! Silver Lining, you have come so far, you just take my breath away. I am so moved by what you wrote.
I, too, respect every woman’s right to make choices about her own life based on whatever reasons are important to her. As I have gone through the process of making my own choices about what to do in my relationship with my husband, I consciously ask myself what I would do apart from finances and then I do that. I grew up poor and I know I can be happy as long as I have those things you talked about, self respect and self love.
Love,
Marie

I needed to read this today and I am so grateful for this site. I can identify with each and everyone of you. I stayed for years because of finances. I went to S-anon meeting and he went to SA meetings, but I turned the other cheek because of the financial stability. However, this past year, I have given that up and am praying that I will get enough alimony in this divorce to live on. If not, I have my dignity back. I I’ve learned that it’s okay to go my separate ways; I have learned that I can’t expect people to always respect every decision that I make… I can’t expect that everybody will completely identify with me but I have to understand that being in a committed relationship doesn’t mean giving my up myself. It means being honest about whom I am today, and being courageous enough to share the reality of myself regardless have how others feel about my decisions. I am committed to learning healthy ways of relating to others, and myself and it’s very important for me to work on me. I am uncertain about my financial future since our divorce is not final, but truth be told, it is never ever about the MONEY.

SL,
You give me strength and inspire me every minute of every day. ‘Nuf said.
XOXO

JoAnn,

I loved how you explained the reasons you continue to stay with Larry. I feel the same way about D. (Also retired USAF) When I met him he was such a different man then when the addiction got a true grip on him. Once it got its hold on him I didn’t know who I had married. It escalated so quickly and spun so out of control I didn’t know which way was up.

D and I share so many common bonds. We laugh and love deeply. He loves my children as his own and shares the same joys and heartaches I do with them.

When I made the decision to stay, I knew I had to have strong boundaries and knew that it would mean that I may end up having to deal with slips (which I included in my BA) but that if he had any further affairs with people, in real life or online, I’d leave. It will break my heart to have to leave, and, I’d be in the poor house, but I just couldn’t go through all of that hurt all over again. It was to painful. A slip with porn is one thing, but with another person is just to much.

I’d rather live in a box than deal with that mess again.

Hugs,

SS