therapist question

I would look at it this way. Your therapist made a recommendation, you asked him, he said yes.I would think that discussion doesn’t need to take up the whole time, maybe you only want to spend 15 or 20 min there? And if he changes his mind, that’s okay… that would still be his choice. You’re not managing his therapy or telling him what to do, you would be having a discussion in a place, time, and manner that he has agreed to and can cancel at any time. So sorry for your pain, how devastating that must have been really came through to me.
Your friend,
Marie

Hi Zumbagirl,

The pain of your 2nd d-day 5 weeks ago must be overwhelming. I am so proud of you for even thinking about to going to his next therapy appointment.

I support you going to his next therapy appointment. If the reason for attending his appointment is to gain a level of understanding of the type of treatment options for him, I think that is a reasonable thing for you to want. I understand that his recovery has to be his own, and that he needs to feel safe in his sessions. Given what you have been through, I would want to have an understanding of the dynamic’s involved with his recovery process.

I arranged to go to one of my husbands appointments. It was one of the scariest things that I did. My reason for going is that he shared with me some of the things that the counselor had shared with him regarding me. I was shocked at what she said, and wanted to speak to her directly about it. My thoughts were that she was not being told the truth about what was happening in our relationship. I am not a confrontational person, but I felt like I had to grab the bull by the horns and see for myself what was going on. I also felt like, this is my life, my husband, and my future. If we are spending money on supporting his recovery, I needed to make sure that what was being discussed in his meetings were accurate and not a twisted fabrication of what he wanted the picture to look like. I really had no idea what would happen at this meeting. I did not know if I would be personally attacked by both of them or if I had the strength to stand up for myself. My suspicions were confirmed when I spoke to her. He had not shared with her the entire truth of our situation. He had told her that he went to a massage parlor when he was in CA because he was fired from his job. He was using the sessions to build up his self esteem from the depression of being fired. He was discussing what his options were regarding the possibilities of starting a new business. He was using her as his private cheer leader and business consultant in steps necessary to start a business. As it turns out, this woman who had wonderful therapy credentials, had just finished her masters in business. Her interests laid in building a business as well, so it was a perfect time for both of them to bounce off ideas. They are both intelligent and I think enjoyed the company and discussions involving business. She was telling him that I was immature and afraid to do what is necessary and support him in the leap of faith in starting a business. I was so shocked at what I was hearing because I wanted to know what any of this had to do with the trauma that I am in regarding the discovery of my husbands SA. What did this have to do with our relationship and how is this helping him to be on a road to recovery in his SA? I knew I was in the wrong place when she shared with both of us that she does not believe in SA and SA is not recognized as a mental illness. She did not think that my husband had problems in relation to this and that his problem was that he is depressed about his career so abruptly ending. She said that he needed my support in repairing his shot ego and that I needed to have more faith in him.
Well, obviously, she has not been told the truth about what was happening in our life. When I tried to make her aware of the reality, she halfheartedly asked him if what I was saying was true. He discounted and minimized what I was saying and she just could not see that this behavior is exactly how a SA responds to the truth.

I am sorry for the length of this story. I am trying to summarize what happened. Anyway, what I am saying is that I am so happy that I went to that meeting. It was very scary, but I found out what was happening in his sessions. I do not deny that he needed some support with his low self esteem based on getting fired from his career as a man in his 50’s. He had a successful career and he defined himself with who he was as a businessman. To have that taken away from you is a painful experience. I was facing the shocking discovery of a husband with SA and learning of sexual activities that he had been involved in during the 25 years of our marriage. Six months after the SA discovery, I was shocked with the news that he was fired. Both of these things are devastating to me.

First and foremost for me were matters of the heart. He supported our family financially for the last twenty years. I supported his career by moving to several different states through the years and being the primary care giver to our family. I understand that our family needed an income to survive in this world, but I was overcome with the grief of discovering the SA and all of the multifaceted issues surrounding knowledge that your husband uses prostitutes.

The fact that he was not addressing this pain and trying to make amends to saving our relationship put me over the top. It helped me to see what his priority is, and it is obviously not me. By going to his meeting and finding out what direction he was taking, I could take a stand at what I thought was important.

I recommend that you go Zumbagirl. You are not out of line and should not feel weird about wanting to know treatment options. Go in strength!!!!!!!! You deserve to know!!!!!

Marie,

Your response to the therapist was awesome.

Wow, it is crazy what we have had to put up with on top of the devastating news of our husbands actions and behaviors.

I wonder how many other stories there are about therapist sessions.

Perhaps, we should start a new post.

Crazy advice from therapists.

Hi ZG,
Always remember your first feelings after an event are the true feelings. As time passes, we can start to question, rationalize, and minimize. Always remember your immediate feelings. Those are your true feelings.

Zumbagirl,

First of all, just a great big hug I am sending your way.

Second of all, WOW!!!!!!!!!!
I see myself in you. Your interaction with your husband could be taken right off a script of mine.
When you indicated your wishes to go with him and he reacted angry and weird, that is sooooooooooooooooo typical!!!!!!!! Than he twist the whole thing and deflects by claiming how insensitive your being for not recognizing his attempt at expressing discomfort. His reaction by being venomous about your taking interest in the future of your life together is not a loving, sincere, response to the pain he has inflicted on you.

NO, you are not over reacting. Like me, I just think you need someone to tell you that this behavior is unacceptable. That does not take away the pain that you are in. It does however, support you in standing up for yourself and your needs.

I read between the lines when you write that …”Maybe he just does feel uncomfortable”… that you want so bad to believe in him. I understand this. I want to be wrong about what my gut is telling me. I want to search his behavior for what I want to see. I want so bad to not believe what is the unfortunate reality.

Trust your gut, like Polly wrote. His tone and his words are really, really there. I know you don’t want to hear it. I don’t either. So please know that I understand that you are holding out for hope. So what do you do? Drop it and go on with your business? No Zumbagirl, store this information in your memory bank. When you find the strength, all of this information will be used in order for you to choose a healthy path for yourself.

I may take awhile, but I will get there too. I choose what is healthy for me regardless of what road my SA might choose.

Cindy

Hey Zumbagirl,
I was thinking that when he said some version of “I’ll do whatever it takes” what he meant, and what so many of our SA’s mean until they are really in recovery…is “I’ll do whatever it takes, unless YOU need it or unless YOU ask me for it” or “I’ll do whatever it takes as long as it’s what I want anyway” or “I’ll pretend to do whatever it takes, by hiding or manipulating.”

Defensiveness exists for a reason, usually to protect or hide something and he brought it out for a reason during that conversation…he felt threatened and that didn’t have anything to do with you and probably everything to do with what might happen if you and his therapist had a chance to talk. You gained a lot of information about your reality today. My experience has been that therapist’s who don’t deal with addicts regularly as a major part of their work are easily manipulated and charmed and snowed by these men, our husbands. My husband had two therapists in his “fake recovery” and he lied to both of them and neither held him accountable. At d-day #2, he found a new therapist who specialized in addiction ( not SA, don’t have any here either) and told her that he would need to be held accountable and that she shouldn’t let him get away with anything and that she could call me anytime and talk….and she did several times, just to confirm what he was saying and make sure he wasn’t leaving things out.

You are in a difficult situation, Zumbagirl….hold your ground and don’t let him make you feel guilty or doubt yourself.
Marie

Hi ZG,

This is what I did after Dday (Nov 2010). I found a female therapist, who did specialize in addictions, with the understanding that, after a few sessions with me, she would recommend a therapist for my husband, one that she knew that was actively working within the addiction field and had already had some success with treating addicts. My husband had already agreed to this arrangement. If he didn’t “click” with the first one (older male) she recommended, there was a list of two more to choose from. He really liked the first one and is seeing him at least two days a week. My husband and I agreed that our individual therapists have our individual permission to consult with each other. If you really like and trust your therapist, this can work out quite well – no confrontations for you (or whatever-let the therapists deal with that crap) and it has been working out better this way than with any other way we had tried before, at least for me and, surprisingly, for my SA. I’m not even close to agreeing to couples therapy now. And he has plenty of work to do on his end before I would even consider doing so. We are separated now and still talk but this is pretty much his last chance and he knows it.

My therapist was quite surprised the first time she spoke with his therapist. I bet you can guess what he was telling his therapist. TSAB (typical sex addict behavior or typical sex addict bullshit), which usually consists of down playing any of their addictions (deflect & minimize) and, in my case, gee, guess he made it sound like I was so depressed I needed electric shock treatments right way. My therapist knew I was very angry and sad but not that sad! Anyway, the two therapists have been able to get so many things right and clear up any issues that, uh, may be “questionable,” that the therapeutic part has gone rather smoothly – so far. It still isn’t easy but it is a little easier on me. The key word here is “me.” I think that, ultimately, this way will actually save money too because all four of us are basically on the same page most of the time instead of veering off course or spinning out to a new planet, specifically the “Addict Planet” which often does not compute with Planet Reality. Hope I’m explaining this correctly.

Using this therapeutic model (as in therapist lingo), go ahead and write that letter and discuss it with your therapist first and then your therapist can, hopefully, advise you how to let your husband’s therapist know your concerns and what is really going on without breaching patient confidentiality. I try to think of it as creating a map. Everyone should want to get from point A to point B but the routes might be very different. So are the detours. Only now, everyone knows and agrees about what points A and B really are. If he’s headed to Canada and I’m on my way to Mexico, there isn’t much sense in trying to route the trip from point B to point C if you can’t make it to point B.

Again, I hope I explained this kind of clearly. What works for one couple might not work for another one and might not work for me in the future. This all new to me and I don’t know what lies ahead. May not want to know either.

Hugs and much love, GZ, and I’ll be thinking about you.

Ann

You can ask questions and make comments, but the therapist cannot discuss anything with you unless your SA gives him permission to speak about anything. So in some instances you may have been allowed to go, but a gage order may be in place for him to not disucss certain things. So that is a good question if you do go see the therapist. If he has permission to discuss everything.

But the big thing here is the therapist only knows what the SA has confessed. I know for certain that my SA is a liar, and sugar coats and omits many things. So I take whatever his therapists say with a grain of salt. Unf. his therapist is not an addiction therapist.

I would send the note, but you really already got your answer when he freaked out. This should be a part of his recovery that he is willing to share, and quite honestly for your sanity you want to be aware of his progress. If he can’t understand that there are two people in this equation then this is going to be an uphill battle from day one.

Like I said before it is customary for the therapist to have the spouse of the SA come in. That way they can here your side of the story. And then its a check and balance for what the SA is saying. Most likely he has been telling stories or he just does not want you to know what they spoke about.

Only if they agree. So lets say your therapist and his therapist are speaking “off the record” then I don;t beleive it can be shared. But i think if both therapist signed the disclosure that it is okay that they speak about the case; I would think it would be okay to share it with you. And you would know if they did the disclosure as you would have had to agree. If they have not done this, then most liekly only the stuff you all discuss together is common knowledge. I don;t think they are to speak about the case if the disclosure was not agreed, however i am sure that does not prevent all discussion since they are in the same office. I would just ask your therapist. That is the best way to find out.
But I think you said you are in a different country, not sure what the laws are there.

Thanks flora, I’ll add it to my list! and I am in Wisconsin, feels like the antarctic right now but at least yesterdays rain melted most of the snow! blahhh could use some sunshine!

I went to a cosa meeting this week and there were so many sad stories. And then I read how the women suffer on this site and it breaks my heart. And they all sound so capable, kind, nurturing, and smart. How on earth did we get here?

So my h went to his first sa meeting last night, came home and told me how he is really going to get better. I asked him if there were sad stories and he said no, not really. wtf? Why are we the only ones who suffer? Is it because they have no feelings? I am profoundly affected by the things I have been hearing. I ache and say prayers every day for all my new sisters. I know that we all deserve better. This is the most selfish, self centered weirdness I have ever seen.

The only story he seemed fascinated by from the sa meeting was – of course – from the female sa that was there. He felt bad for her. Lord help me.