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I’ve only posted a time or two – have been gleening wisdom from all the forums where you ladies share your experiences and thoughts. That might make me a “lurker” – ugh, I hope not. I’ve just seen so many things that clarified the characteristics of half-hearted recovery; things I kept thinking my fear was seeing and dismissing as coming from my gut. So, first, let me thank all of you for your transparenecy in sharing your stories for newbies like myself to become better informed. I think I’ve learned more from you than all the books, counselling sessions and groups combined.
What I’ve learned is that a rat is a rat is a rat. How many times must a rat appear before I finally get the strength and courage to see it for what it is? Last Saturday was the day I recognized it was a week ago Monday, then Saturday night and every night since as these new anxiety attacks have kicked in.
So I told him this morning I couldn’t do this anymore. I won’t do this anymore. I asked him if he had a friend he would stay with for a while so i could have time to sort things out. He said no. And he THOUGHT that was the final word. Wrong.
After he left for work, I packed up any of his clothes and toiletries and such and checked him into a hotel. I then texted him to let him know what room number, that the room was paid for and that the key would be waiting for him at the front desk. He was livid. Why? Not because we were separating but because I spent the money. Poor honey. I shoulda just left his stuff on the curbside at his job. That woulda been free.
Anyway, I told him I need a month and I don’t care where he stays. May 25 we will talk if he wants and, with our csat, see where he is in recovery. Bless his heart, I pissed him off again. He ended the call abruptly with a few demeaning, harsh accusations about me and I left just in time to make my 2pm appt with the attorney.
I tell ya, sitting and wondering for so many months if being a stay-at-home mom who gave up her career to support her husband’s and raise the babies makes the prospect of leaving scary. I heartily recommend meeting with an attorney to see what you’re entitled to, even if you aren’t ready to make a formal decision about divorce yet. The information was empowering. He agree with the 30 separation, told me to start cyphening money out of accounts and, if and when I was ready, come in and “take his ass to hell”. I liked him.
But, more than that, I am beginning to feel like the old me. I’m not anxious and shaky, scared and fearful of what shoe is going to fall out of the sky next.
Any suggestions that might help prepare me for dealing with the spouse as this unfolds would be appreciated.
In the meantime, thank you for being who you are and letting me and others like me learn from your hard-learned wisdom. Don’t ever let anyone tell you that you don’t matter. You make a difference everytime you share a piece of your life.
Gratefully,
KarynKaryn,
It feels good to take your power back and stand up for yourself. I applaud you because what you did takes guts and I know it must feel good to take care of you best interest.I would recommend ‘no contact’ because this is when all the hooks come out. The less said the best said, otherwise he’s going to manipulate you like crazy and they are sooo good when they are desperate you don’t even know they are doing it.
Move the money I’m your name only as fast as you can. Change passwords, move everything especially any cash. You attny sounds like he’s done this before. Don’t be shy about it because if you don’t do it he will.
Thinking of you and keep taking good care of yourself and best interest.
Love, Nap
PS. Change the locks too if your attny says ok otherwise he’ll be moving right back in.
Karyn you rock!!! I cant wait to reply more but my daughter is getting confirmed in 30 minutes. I will be saying prayers for all of us!
I love and get the feeling that your old self is coming back!
hugs
heidiGet a tape recorder and every time he calls let him leave a msg then call him back on speaker phone and record every conversation. If he threatens physical harm with a direct threat like I’m going to beat your ass or kill you call the police and report it. I’m going to get you or watch your back may not be direct enough for some pd’s but we all know what it means. Hold your ground or you lose all credibility and find out if you can change the locks legally in a separation and change any alarm codes you may have if you have a house alarm. You always want to know if he comes over and that’s one way to know. If he needs something left behind use a third party or leave it on your doorstep and have no contact with him. Watch those bank accts as well. Pull credit reports if needed to find out if new accts get opened. If you trust a neighbor ask them to let you know if he’s seen at your house. Forward your mail to a po box so he can’t take it. The USPS will forward your mail or hold it for you to pick up if you don’t want to get a po box. Just a few suggestions this far and congrats for taking this huge step. It’s not easy but it’s needed. I’m 6 weeks into my separation.
Our dear sister, Karyn,
I lurked on the other site for months.Your post is so authentic in its heart breaking loss, unbelievable courage and its crack of light coming through the rubble.
You are another heroine for me. An inspiration. Yes, it’s not an easy road to risk leaving and believe in the unknown life ahead. But what a great thing to discover yourself again. I know exactly what it feels to have been slipping away over the years, and then find I could get myself back, bit by bit by bit.
Your lawyer sounds great. Hold steady and follow his lead.
While you feel write some affirmations that are true in the moments, things you see clearly and feel clearly. Because there likely will be a moment when you are a little shaky about things. The affirmations will be handy to read and remind yourself of the searing truth.
As far as your spouse goes, be careful. He knows that your head is going to get even more clear with his craziness out of the house. Losing control can be the worst thing for them.
If he pleads he’s freshly committed, just affirm that’s the best course for him, regardless of your decisions.May light surround you,
Diane.xoKaryn-I am in awe at your courage and strength. A lot of us, including myself, can learn from your decision. The best thing to do is step aside and get your thinking cap on. I was on the fence way too long. I think if I would have taken that first step, as you have, I wouldn’t have wasted 3 yrs. with on again-off again promises from my h who couldn’t deliver.
You mention anxiety attacks. This entire trauma of living with an SA takes a toll on our physical and mental well-being, and it is a sign that tells us no more.
My only advice to you, right now, is do not let him play with your emotions and tug at your heart. This 30 day period is an excellent time to get your thoughts together and make an informed decision. I would also recommend no contact with him during this time so that you do have that time without any drama to interfere with you processing all of this.
I am so glad you have found solace on s.o.s. I am a psych nurse, and have learned more on this site about sex addiction and the dynamics of lieing and manipulation than I did my entire career. These women on here are well educated and informed on the subject.
I think one of the most profounding thing for me was not to listen to his words, but pay attention to his behavior. These guys are so adept at faking recovery and trying to hook us back in. I hope your h is not one of those.
Good luck in your endeavor, and please stay with us for love and support.
Hugs to you,
SharronKaryn,
Good for you! You are a star! I admire your guts and style.
Be careful about the credit reports- it’s fraud to get someone else’s credit report, so get legal okay for that.
Watch your kids- until there is court order, he can take them and legally you can’t do anything. Don’t allow any contact that you don’t want him to have permanently. For example, if you want supervised then supervise now. If you don’t want overnights, don’t allow overnights now. Allow some access but make it is on your terms.
Watch the bank accounts and get an account in your own name, if you can. In Texas where I live, its all community property anyway, so no harm in moving it. So do whatever works in your state to make sure you have access to money.
I agree with no contact. Everything you say can and will be twisted and used against you.
Take care of yourself. Do whatever you need to do to keep yourself strong. Don’t be afraid to ask for help from friends.
Hold on to that resolve and don’t ever look back.I just want to clarify that by taking the kids, I mean snatching or kidnapping, whatever you want to call it.
I am so proud of you and for you. I am also jealous … Maybe there is hope for me yet. My attorney also recommended stashing money and making sure to know about all retirement funds etc… Stay strong.
Bev
Karyn,
As the other ladies have said, I am in awe of you and I am inspired by you. I plan to learn a lot from you! 🙂 I definitely don’t have divorce advice, but listen to those who have gone before you!Hang in there!
Love ZG
p.s. There is no such thing as a “lurker” here. I believe this site is for all of us to use as we see fit. When you feel the time is right to post, go for it. There’s no quota as far as I’m concerned. 🙂 xoxo!Thanks so much for the affirmation and words of wisdom. I don’t think our kids are a concern because they are 21 and 18. Whew! He did come by the house after he got off work. Our 18 year old was rear-ended last week and her car was totalled. He called to say he was coming by for tools to go get the after market stereo we gave her as a Christmas gift and replace it with the one that came with the car. I didn’t see him. He came back an hour or so later, called as he pulled into the driveway and said he needed to get the keys to daughter’s car. I took them outside to him. Quicken is on my computer and he pays the bills (we do it together, but I’m mostly just watch to know what’s happening with the money. He said he needs to pay bills and wanted to come back tonight. I told him tonight wasn’t a good time, but I have my conference call LIFE group tomorrow night and he could come by from 6-8 to do bills while I was doing that. He spoke in a very sad, wounded tone but agreed, I don’t know if it’s manipulation or not, but am so glad to have the peace in the house I didn’t spend any time trying to figure it out. He texted daughter later and said he would like to take off work at lunch and take her car shopping. She agreed which is necessary and fine with me since she is comfortable with it.
So, still, but minimal and, thus far, necessary.
A problem I see and am not sure how to deal with is asking for the house key and garage door opener back. I don’t want to antagonize the situation but don’t trust him to respect my request to call before he comes for anything he needs – NOT to just drop in. Is there a nice way to ask for the key and garage door opener that will prevent conflict? Changing the locks is an expensive proposition that I’d like to avoid if I can, but will if I don’t have any option. All the counselling and workshop intensives have pretty much depleted our reserves and I’m reluctant to spend anything I don’t have to.
Why is it that the 23 years he led a double life I didn’t know about, he was a kind and loving husband to me and once the secret life came out he turned into an ass? Initially, I thought it might be because the “self-medicating” of porn and worse being gone was the reason. Truthfully, though, I have no reason to believe he’s in full recovery. Even our therapist is doubtful and told me today he was ready to encourage me to consider separation right before I told him that’s what I had done.
I hate this. I really wanted the real version of what I thought I had for all those years. There’s still hope, but it’s minimal and, at 52, I just can’t see letting him make me a lunatic by staying in a marriage to someone who can’t (won’t?) be a faithful man with integrity.
As much as I hate it, I have to say I love the peace more. Turns out that the fear of letting go was much worse than actually doing it. Funny how things work that way.
Did I mention he is an ass? I did? Ok, good. Want to make sure that’s clear. And, by the way, he is an ass.
Karyn59,
You are my hero!!! Thank you for posting about all that is going on with you. I am going to learn from you I can tell. I am here to support you and be your biggest fan!!!!
Love, Cindy
Dear Karyn,
I have been wondering what you have been up to since I overwhelmed you with my story on chat. 😉 Seems you have been busy finding the “light”. I can see you are a lady and a class act and u have made quite an impression on the sisters. 😉 To answer your question re: why their approach changes after discovery…I like the analogy of the cornered rat. Prior to discovery, we play the role that they assign to us. We don’t realise we (except for those women who know from the very beginning that something is amiss with their H) are doing this, because we trust that everything is as they say it is? We are happy, trusting and not looking beyond their words because we don’t think we need to.This makes it fairly easy for them to conduct their secret lives. After the game is up…we no longer play our assigned role. Suddenly, we make demands, we express our pain, we make life decidely more difficult than it was before. If we don’t become downright hostile we go the other way and try to establish a close connection. The rats don’t want either of these options.They just want things to go back to the way they were as quickly as possible. They agree to therapy…even offer it up.They don’t comprehend what is going to be asked of them in therapy, but when they find out they are not happy. They are takers, suddenly put into a position with a giver who wants something back. They become asses (as u so delicately put it- we have some more colorful names for them) because they are no longer in the driver’s seat, they can no longer have their cake and eat it too, they suddenly get that they are going to have to give something up and they don’t want to. They lose control and their lies are no longer effective. They are angry, angry, angry that they cannot have their own way… so they do what a cornered rat does…they go for your throat? They hope to intimidate you into backing down or backing off. They are very good at this and it is easy to disarm someone who is shocked, broken hearted and traumatized beyond belief. They are NOT faithful men with integrity. They are the direct opposite of that description, so they try valiantly to get u back on their hook. Sounds like u are NOT prepared to take the bait and I am very glad to hear that. You didn’t have what you thought you had for all those years and it is highly unlikely that he could ever give you that. As we are fond of saying…it is what it is and accepting that is perhaps the hardest part of all? karen xx
PS are u finished with him or just taking a break?
Kmf,
Your description using the rat was awesome. You put into words exactly what I have been saying. It is that moment when they realize they have lost control of what is going to happen.
Sometimes I feel like after my husbands secret was revealed, he thought confessing to being a SA and going into treatment would be enough to “make it right again”. Once he realized what was involved and that I expected to see recovery, he started back pedaling. Sometimes I wonder if he jumped into the deep end wearing a life vest called Sex addiction therapy that he thought would rescue him out of the troubled water. Once he realized that the vest wasn’t saving him, he wanted to take it off. I remember him than changing his story and telling me that he was’nt really a SA, but that his counselor said that he was “compulsive” with sex. It seemed to me that he was an SA when it was convenient to use that umbrella term. He could use that term if it meant shelter to him. In other words, explain away behaviors as part of the disease, except when it meant he had to step up to the plate and actually recover. Than all of a sudden he really did not have something to “recover from” because he really isn’t a SA.
This was very hard for me to deal with in terms of my own recovery. Wanting to give him the benefit of the doubt mixed with trying to comprehend what the hell is going on? Educating myself about SA was the only way that I could make sense of what I was being exposed to. After getting to that point, finding myself in counseling sessions with therapist who have not had SA experience made me question what I had learned. This just added to the impact of the trauma of the whole original exposure and made me wonder if I was losing my mind. I feel like things just kept snow balling out of control right up to finding out he wanted a divorce. I am thinking to myself, “Now wait a minute. You now want a divorce because your secret life was discovered. You told me you believe that you are a sex addict. You go to SA therapy. I expect you to recover. This pisses you off, because you don’t like to be told what to do. Your pissed that I have researched SA and believe that you have this problem. You tell me that you don’t have time or patience to deal with my sorrow. You twist everything around saying that I have anger management issues. I am making a big deal out of nothing and you say we did not have that great of a marriage anyway. You act as if I am not taking responsibility to fix the marriage and if I can’t admit to being 50% responsible for the marriage break down, you want a divorce.
It is really exhausting….. But thank you for letting me just write it again all. I guess I just have to keep writing it and reading it over and over again. Just so that I can make my mind believe that this really happened.
Karyn,
Thank God for you that you saw through this and trusted yourself. It is a blessing really. I am so happy that you believed in yourself and have not tortured yourself the way I have done to myself. I am getting better. Little by little. I am getting there. Seeing your strength helps me, and I thank you for sharing so that we all can see the light.
Hugs, Cindy
Cindy,
I know it is hard, but I am SO GLAD you will be away from that jackass!!!! OMG!! He sucks donkey dicks!!! (sorry Claire!) 🙂
Wow…. He takes the cake! You will be so much better without him! I hate him.
Love,
SL
When I discovered the first affair I poured myself into fixing our marriage. We went to an affair recovery intensive and they did profile tests on us. My h is a 90% taker and I am a 90% giver. I believe all us sisters are in the same boat, and one of our biggest problems is we don’t know how to be takers.
With those percentages how could I be 50% to blame for anything? He takes. I give. f’ing other women…my fault?
my h keeps wanting me to take some responsibility. I told him I could be an axe murderer and that does not give him permission to sleep with someone else’s wife. ….lets go ask their husbands!
and my h still argues that he is impulsive not compulsive. That just makes him impulsive not a sa. He defends all the planning by saying he is just organized.karyn this is a crazy messed up life, I admire your clarity, be strong and confident.
Be a taker, tell the giver in you to take a vacation.These guys are all pretty much the same- just a few of the details here and there. How can the therapists get it so damn wrong when it is so damn obvious? This is no-brainer stuff. Only person responsible for addiction behavior is the addict. I don’t care if the wife is “enabling” or “controlling” or any of that nonsense. That doesn’t excuse a damn thing.
If they went out and robbed a bank without us knowing it, would we have a part in it?
They are all pretty much the same…rotten to the core just like all bad apples. God…but some of them are absolute a–holes!
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