- This topic has 61 replies, 24 voices, and was last updated 11 years, 1 month ago by
.
-
Posts
-
yes, Deb. Those are THE questions for us, aren’t they?
I guess the answer to the second one is as JoAnn described it—we have to have a psychiatrist on the team. But how to get someone from 12 step to a psychiatrist’s office???? Seems like a pretty big grown-up unnarcissistic leap for someone being given the option of “surrendering” to a higher power as the ultimate solution. Sounds like we need assessment programs that have this as a standard piece.
In 2008, 4 yrs ago, 1 in 5 people have a personality disorder with narcisstic being the most prevalent and is so much so today they are not listing it in the new DSM. That means of 100 of woman on SOS, 20 of us or more have a PD. Ill go ahead and admit I likely have one just don’t know which one it is.
I personally think PD’s are over-diagnosed, because what we’re really seeing are untreated symptoms of TRAUMA. Treat the trauma first, and see what’s left. Maybe a PD, maybe not.
There were two incidents of real trauma in my SBTXSAH’s life, and I can see the damage there. What is odd is that he has been in counseling of some form for almost half his married life with his previous wife, and that stuff was NEVER addressed. He keeps redirecting his counseling experiences, even now, to his youngest daughter’s issues. He thinks that is his success, in hiding all that. How does anyone ever NOT become PD with that approach?
March, I learned that somewhere else- can’t remember where. That women with PTSD in particular are overdiagnosed with a personality disorder. How else would explain our craziness in reaction to this stuff (and other abuse that women can be subjected to) before the trauma was recognized?
March – I agree. I think that many folks with PDs just walk around with the dysfunction of their untreated trauma. So if their trauma is treated – will their PD’s dissipate?
Another impt question is – what is the best way to treat trauma? It seems that there are good trauma therapists and ones that aren’t so good. I just heard Obama talk about it in the debate tonight – how soldiers need to be effectively treated for PTSD. What about incest survivors? Rape victims? The victims of child and domestic violence? And…..what about us?
I do wonder what the long term effect of my PTSD (which seems to have gotten better) might be? Will I develop a PD?
My mom is a big narcissist – likely the result of childhood incest. Same thing with my SAH’s mother (who also incested him). I sometimes wonder if that’s why we bonded. We were both not accustomed to having a healthy attachment.
At any rate – I fired the PD question to a few CSATs that I know – and also Minwalla. I’ll be interested in what they have to say……
Deb
My understanding is that PDs are developed before adulthood. Personality disorders do not come along due to trauma in adulthood. I’m struggling with the 1 in 5 having a PD. I had the sense that PD’s are not commonly diagnosed. I agree with the idea of treating the trauma, then seeing what’s left.
Yes Penny, you are correct. PD’s develop before adulthood and the traits are enduring and stable throughout the entire lifetime.
That is a requirement for a diagnosis of a Personality Disorder.
Again, here is the criteria:
The current Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-IV) describes a Personality Disorder as “an enduring pattern of inner experience and behavior that deviates markedly from the expectations of the individual’s culture, is pervasive and inflexible, has an onset in adolescence or early adulthood, is stable over time and leads to distress or impairment.”
It is unclear why children develop Personality Disorders but most experts agree that there are both environmental (trauma) and genetic (predisposition) factors.
Once you have a PD it does not go away. It is who you are.
Adults do not develop Personality Disorders. They may react to trauma and life experiences in various ways, and some of these behaviors might last a lifetime, but they do not have a true Personality Disorder.
To summarize, Personality Disorders must have these criteria:
1. an enduring pattern of inner experience and behavior
2. deviates markedly from the expectations of the individual’s culture
3. is pervasive and inflexible
4. has an onset in adolescence or early adulthood
5. is stable over time
6. leads to distress or impairment
~ JoAnn
If you think about these criteria, and strongly consider number 3, the behaviors and traits are pervasive and inflexible, and number 5, they are stable over time, you have to recognize that if a Sex Addict does have a Personality Disorder, by the very fact of that diagnosis, he cannot change.
~ JoAnn
Here are the statistics for Mental Disorders:
Mental Disorders in America
Mental disorders are common in the United States and internationally. An estimated 26.2 percent of Americans ages 18 and older — about one in four adults — suffer from a diagnosable mental disorder in a given year.1 When applied to the 2004 U.S. Census residential population estimate for ages 18 and older, this figure translates to 57.7 million people.2 Even though mental disorders are widespread in the population, the main burden of illness is concentrated in a much smaller proportion — about 6 percent, or 1 in 17 — who suffer from a serious mental illness.1 In addition, mental disorders are the leading cause of disability in the U.S. and Canada.3 Many people suffer from more than one mental disorder at a given time. Nearly half (45 percent) of those with any mental disorder meet criteria for 2 or more disorders, with severity strongly related to comorbidity.1
In the U.S., mental disorders are diagnosed based on the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, fourth edition (DSM-IV).4
You can get more information here:
All personality disorders are mental disorders. Not all mental disorders are personality disorders. Like all trees are plants, but not all plants are trees.
Thanks March, I knew that, just typed it in wrong.
I’ll change my heading from Personality Disorders to Mental Disorders. ~ JoAnn
Not long after I learned the full extent (or as much as I will ever know) of my H’s behavior I went to see a very nice psychiatrist in Singapore (not the one who assessed my husband) for something to help me sleep. I ended up seeing him a few times and he also met with my husband and referred him on. This Dr was very spiritual- his office and waiting room were littered with references to God and his grace. Eventually, I asked him if he thought that someone like my H could be helped in any real way. He looked at me with great compassion and said, ” Karen, the behavior has existed so long and is so entrenched that I can only say you would be clutching at straws. Invest in your own life, you cannot help him.” Clutching at straws…false hope…refusing to emotionally accept what you know to be rationally true……
It occurs to me that I was very lucky to meet the therpaeutic people that I did. I didn’t buy sexual addiction OR it’s treatment model. No one tried to make me co anything and I was warned to protect myself. I listened. It was tremendously painful but at least the cut was clean.
Karen xxThe difference between the two for me personally is catching him again BEFORE he admits it (per our signed post nup-Thank you Texas) which is oh, let me do the math……about $450K, not including his recently upped life insurance of $360 from $250. They come Mon to draw his blood btw for that new policy.
Can you say CHA-CHING!!
I can….
Every yr his retirement grows $100K, and every year mine grows $50K….
spinning around…I say “Im Gone with the Wind Fabulous.”
Thank you Texas.
Wow FN what does he do? Just be as sweet as pie so he will think all is well. I’ve never heard of post-nup. Hope he smokes.
Yeah For Now….I am also wondering what he does that generates that much retirement earnings every year??? I always assumed he was a cop like you.
SOT, neither had he until For Now nailed his ass with one….if I recall correctly? 😉
If you stay with any of these guys then I strongly urge you to consult an attorney about post nup type agreements in your area. No need to stay and be heartbroken and financially broken and fighting a court battle…..
Even if FN’s H is a cop, his pension can absolutely grow like that because it is a Government job and Unions get the best pension deals ever….
Hello – ladies wanted to refer to KMF’s earlier post in the thread. what that wise therapist said – “invest in your own life.”
that is what real hope looks and feels like. when we invest in our own lives.
investing our energes in our SAH, or exsah’s, is throwing good efforts at bad ones. how does it help?
I think for most, the long stemmed deep engrained behaviors, are permanent. it’s brain damage, there may be improvement from time to time, but the condition is always there. It is potent and lethal to partners. beware. proceed with caution, for those who stay.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.