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I am curious about this topic and curious about what drives them to do these things.
I know we say its childhood abuse or something engrained in childhood, personality disorder.
But what drives your h to do it?
Pam C h appeared it was stress from the bills.
My h appeared to be stress of life, but also a constant obsession with sex. (So two things going)
Then we have those who are triggered and do not know they are triggered, that maybe it is engrained in their soul. Like Sharrons h i think.
They say addiction are typically done to alter a mood. Wether that be drugs, alchohal etc. But with sex addiction there is also an obsession, more obsessive complusion going on. Right now i guess the medical community reads it as more of a compulsion which they cannot control. But it would appear to be both in some or just one in some.then we have supposed triggers, which in my h’s case is life.
Is it an addiction or is it a defunct coping mechanism for life?
So many thoughts and so many questions.
Share your thoughts and what drives your h to sex addiction??
Thanks,
FloraHi Flora
Good question!
With my ex it was responsibility or stress of any kind. Could be something like Pam Cs H or a bigger event such as me getting pregnant for the first time. That’s the earliest date I can trace his addiction back to. I don’t know how much is the addiction dealing with altering mood and how much the stress becomes an excuse for acting out. What I mean is, maybe the addiction starts because they need to alter their mood but does that then become a handy excuse once they’re hooked to excuse what they are doing – I couldn’t help it because you did this, or my boss did that etc etc etc.
Who knows? All I know is that I couldn’t live with walking on eggshells all the time, worrying that if I had a bad day I would get blamed for ‘making’ him act out. It’s no way to live.
Bb
xI still have absolutely no idea what type of SA my POS H is. His stories as to why he has done these things changes on a monthly basis. The more I learn, the more I’m convinced he is just the town pervert with a severe underlying personality disorder; actually I believe him to have more than one. I find him to be a narcissistic man who is passive aggressive and has absolutely NO IDEA what intimacy, love or a real relationships is. He’s completely delusional and in total denial. With all the lies he spews, who knows what he is. It’s been more than an entire year since the initial d-day, and the stories continue to change, and the lies continue to vomit out of his mouth.
Hi Flora,
This is a great forum you started and very interesting. I guess the way i see it, it usually starts in the teenage years with porn and masterbation. Which is somewhat normal, however, for a developing SA it serves the purposes of reducing anxiety, the high they get from the orgasm, and it becomes habitual, it also medicates any emotional pain they may have.As time passes, it has to become more and more stimulating to get the high they need. Different porn, start visualizing sex with co workers, woman on TV, in public places. Then some take the big step and start to act on their impulses and actually have sex with real bodies, any way they can. This brings the high to a whole new level. It’s a pot luck of woman to dine through in a sense. Then some will add men or couples to up the ante, or try going with really young girls….whatever it takes for the next fix. The addiction cycle gets well established years ago and it contniues on and on til they are living one “fix” to the next. It changes their brains and they develop all these horrible addict behaviors we talk about every day.
An addict of any kind is very difficult to live with. Why? They are totally self destructive. Without proper sobriety and treatment, they will not only self destruct themselves, they will take you, your kids, the finances, their jobs, their life down with them. This is why it is so important, if we stay or not, to be as healthy as we can, so two lives aren’t destroyed.
nap
PS Some addicts are love addicts and they tend to act out with affairs. Some are both.
I like what you wrote NAP. From what I can gather, it appears my SA has been on the path you spoke of; he must keep pushing the envelope in order to get whatever it is he’s getting from it. I’m still not sure what he does get from it, as he’s a pathological liar and I no longer know what the reason is. But I can tell you that I’m a attractive, smarty, witty and sexually healthy woman, and my SA chose to frequent prostitutes that were 200 pounds heavier me, and at least 25 years my senior. He told me it was for the variety, but there was NO variety in the type of woman he chose to pay. Older, obese, and ugly. And some of them he saw more than once. Where is the variety in that? He also did things with them that he refused to do with me {aka foreplay, kissing, etc} because he told me he felt “wrong” and “uncomfortable” doing those things, and never really liked it. The type of porn he watched, however, was mainly anal and trannie. Which is totally different than the type of people he was cheating on me with. The trashy chics he webcammed with looked exactly like the prostitutes he chose, aside from the occasional trannie and couple.
I still think it all comes down to him being the town pervert.I think NAP said it well. Started young and became a habit that, like a starving child, keeps saying “Feed me.” As logical as that sounds in my head, it doesn’t make sense in my heart, if you have any connection with a person or value them or your relationship.
I find it so confusing. Once he told me he felt entitled after a disagreement. Then he said it was a habit. What is amazing to me, is that he would do it after I was with him!!! Hypersexuality. Sex, he once admitted, was his number one priority. He would act out even when we were on vacation having a wonderfully intimate time, on a “B. Trayed survived cancer” retreat…He viewed many women getting off with all of our family sleeping feet away from the TV on one vacation. It is totally confusing to me. He could be happy, sad, alone, with family, at a tv or computer, on his jobs, or after sex with me…it did not matter. So if it is just habit from a lifetime of masterbation, lust, and fantasy since being a teen, he is messed up. He has viewed sexuality and women wrongly for 35 years. That is dreadful to me. I wish he had only acted out in specific situations, and we could work on those types of situations. But no, it is much more complicated than that, much more pervasive.
He also said, after disclosure, that he was never an addict and could have stopped at any time??? ok, why ruin my life if you did not think it was that tough to stop? Why potentially let our young children see your sexual women, when on a family vacation. He is as clueless as I am.
Honestly, he just attributes it to our sinful natures. Yeah, that is just a cop out. We all have the capability of acting in immoral ways, but come on, we don’t all do this kind of stuff and just pass it off as a little devil on our shoulder. He made choice after choice, knowing all the lies, deception and sexual immorality were ridiculous. Even now when we chat, he says, “Well, I did some things wrong and so do you; we all do.” Yeah, my not having a good dinner every night is equal to your 20 years of torture and emotional/sexual betrayal. I don’t think so.
My guess as to what motivated my SA to do these things…Pure self-enjoyment…when, where, how…that never mattered. My only question…why?
B. TrayedHi all,
I think at some point, and very likely early on, their brains get rewired to their addiction. Hence, all the irrational thinking they share with us on a daily basis and also irrational behaviors. The only way an addicts brain can change is by becoming sober and actually working recovery. If they can do this, their brains with not use the addictive pathways and have healthy pathways working. If your SA never does sobriety and recovery, you will always be living with a full blown addict and expect nothing to change. There is nothing we can do or say to them. They need to change their brains…and at some level we have to accept this reality and make healthy choices for ourselves.I agree with what everyone says. For a long time i waxed and wained over wether or not my h was an addict. Really Truely still do.
Becuase this is how I view it. They had the history of starting out young, found that it gives such pleasure and joy and they continue on and on for the rest of their life. So what would you rather do…go to work or have sex all day (i am not asking us, but basically the h). And what would he say, of course have sex all day.My h’s current therapist feels its addiction because he said he would stop and he did not. BFD. Can;t that also just be just a selfish ass??
I still sit on the fence with alot of this stuff and with the h’s. I think some of it is purely choice, plain and simple. And most of these guys, my h included, sex is their most important need. When we would go out, he would constantly scan for women who met his mo. then he would look at them, in a way as i would not notice. He prided himself on being able to find positive features in women and that he as very good at it. Well what about their hearts and souls, what about our hearts and souls. Some of me feels that this is just a selfish world where women exist to totally serve their purpose and every need. I also think it is a conveniant excuse to do bad things (as my attorney put it).
I also find the issue of triggers interesting. I think we have spoke in the past that an h would not know the triggers. But I have also heard that the computer can be a trigger, the sound of it booting up, the beach, women everywhere, the mall, victorias secret, craiglist? I think for my h it was the minute i left the house?!?!
Anyway thanks ladies. Would love to hear some more input.
B.t.,
Its very telling what your husband says to you. “entitled”, “habit”, and “sex is my number one priority”. To an addict, their drug (in our cases, sex is the drug) it is their number one priority, they love it and don’t want to give it up. It makes them feel good, medicates their feelings, and feeds their underdeveloped egos. This hurts us dearly and at our core, they don’t care they need their habit, they are entitled, and its their number one priority over us and everything else. It’s not a pretty picture when it’s all laid out.
napwhat if for some is like hair color,skin tone its not the brain? my partner needs no reason he states. that in its self is reason enough. i asked him what attracts him to a woman he said nothing does, makes me to believe if anything had breasts it would be good enough, age, looks, humans play no part for him. so could this sex addicts just be like freckles?????
Great post, Flora,
Your husband couldn’t stop his behavior in spite of real and very negative consequences, and therein lies the difference between someone who enjoys something and someone who is addicted and is unable to stop their behavior.
My husband acted out when he felt close to me, as a way to avoid closeness and reestablish the distance he needed.He doesn’t act out when stressed….if there was something stressful going on, he was there, rock solid. He deals with his stress. But if things were “normal” and we were happy and life was good…..that’s when there was a problem. I also found on thinking back that with every increasing level of responsibility and commitment…engagement, then wedding, then first child, subsequent children……the need to withdraw and distance and act out was stronger. A marriage therapist we saw called porn “the anti-intimacy drug”. Boy, do I agree with that!
MarieHi all,
Lets face it these guys are so complex for having such a one tract mind??? Kind of an oxymoron. Just the fact that sex takes up 95% of their thinking on a day to day basis, we know they are not truly fully functioning at anything. They may have a job, and be just getting by. Many are fired from jobs due to inappropriate behavior or poor work performance. (mine was fired from a job when a husband called the HR dept. and threaten a sexual harassment lawsuit, my h was having an affair with his wife). Some wont even work at all because how can they do both? What kind of parent and partner are they? Are they fully engaged with the kids and do they help us and support us?
What kind of relationship is it?Yes no kidding. Porn is exactly that. the statistics of porn use and teenage boys is staggering, and I fear what type of boys and men my daughters will be dating, because it is really running rampant.
You said – “Your husband couldn’t stop his behavior in spite of real and very negative consequences, and therein lies the difference between someone who enjoys something and someone who is addicted and is unable to stop their behavior.”
I think given a person like you or me, who is very conscientious of others…this would be a true statement. But lets take “normal” thoughts and feelings out of the equation. What if these guys are not normal…and continue to pursue their choices because that is what they want to do despite any others thoughts and feelings. I don;t think that 100% means that he is an addict, but what it does mean is he has no regard for my thoughts and feelings of others. This is also classic of narcisism, intimacy anorexia and a sociopath (i am sure there are many others). I am not arguing either way, but sometimes i think the statements that are made by therapists are assuming that these guys are 100% ligit, 100% normal, 100% right in the head and truthfull and caring. And that is not always 100% true. 25% of the population is a socipath, so what are the odds that a good number of these guys are sociopaths – probably 25% or higher.Thanks Marie.
FloraHi NAP, totally agree.
I think that there is a bell curve with these guys to. Some may be on the low end, some in the middle and some on the far side (hopefully they are in prison). I think with therapy and outlook that it is not a one size fits all approach. but one thing that appears in therapy, as well as the judicial system, is they are innocent until proven guilty. In other words we are going to assume your h has an addiction, and is operating on a fully functioning emotional and intellectual system, until proven guilty. and its not poven guilty by us the spouse, its proven guilty in their minds of the therpist.Before all of this i assumed that everyone was most likely operating at 100%, not one brick short of a load. In this I realized that I project to much of my goodwill and truth onto others. And i worry in therapy that they do the same and are not innocent until proven guilty (much like i use to think).
I am beginning to think in a new perspective that everyone is guilty until proven innocent (just kidding). But what i have learned is not everyone is truthful and honest. Even those who might appear together, sometimes don;t have it together at all.
im going to go out on a limb here, just so ideas or thoughts i have with the changes in the world could this just be the beginning of whats to come? we as a whole need to label things, my son is 21 and if he was born to day i think no, i know they would have told me hes autistic. given the way he was as a child yet now today he would not be. he was different he sees the world different but he is fine with who he is. with the way the world is changing the Internet in my thoughts with how i see it is changing the fundamentals of life and how people are. how people see and feel each other. how can someone feel words i know at first when my partner wrote me i would read and feel his words. but i see now it was his words but my feeling my emotions i added.not his. many times my kids would read something a friend wrote online and get mad i would read it and see no reason for it. words are for who reads them not who wrote them. with all the advances in texting, internet people are feeling less human connection, if i look even deeper video games take this even a step up when sept 11 happen my then 11 year old felt nothing more then ok, his brother worked in the towers i asked my son a few days later why it didnt seem to bother him he said ive seen worse stuff on my games. i said its fake he said but it could happen that way.
Hi Flora and all,
I have to say I don’t know who my husband is. Knowing now how much he has lied, hid things, been decietful, lack of remorse, no apologies, anger and rage to defend his behaviors, all the cheating, money spent on sex in some way shape or form, pretending to to sober, etc….there’s more I’m just tired of typing….I don’t know who he is, he doesn’t know who he his, and based on the facts I do know, I don’t like him anymore.Hi Katt,
Yes they say as a whole society is moving toward a more narcistic (can never spell this word) view. I think the latest generation is generation me, so aptly named.
They don’t talk on the phone, they don’t play with friends, they stay home, play video games and watch TV. I do worry for them. things are changing, and i am not so certain that it is for the good…at all.
when we were little we barely watched TV ( i am 36) cable was around as well as interent and video games) when i was younger, but we never had those toys. We lived on 5 acres in ohio and played outside. We did chores, we had animals, horses, dogs rabbits. And thats what we did. I talked to my friends on the phone and i did sport and after school hobbies.
So worried for the futures of the young ones. thanks katt.Flora
Hi Katt,
I liked your post and your perspective. I think we do, to some degree get desensitized by all the internet stimulation we can get on a day in day out basis. In the old days, when we were kids, we used our imaginations, socialized a lot more, and our exposure to “extremes” were very limited, maybe an Alfred Hichkoch movie at best. I agree with you, this is having an affect on our lives if we realize it or not. Although it can be very useful, it also can be damaging in many ways. Also. without seeing body language face to face we can interpret typed expressions from another totally wrong. Very interesting Katt!This is a great conversation. My mind is racing with connections and I’m going to bullet point them out because it is too much work to try to make a masterpiece essay!
Flora wonders – Is this an addiction or a coping mechanism?
NAP writes – I think at some point, and very likely early on, their brains get rewired to their addiction. Hence, all the irrational thinking they share with us on a daily basis and also irrational behaviors. The only way an addicts brain can change is by becoming sober and actually working recovery. If they can do this, their brains with not use the addictive pathways and have healthy pathways working. If your SA never does sobriety and recovery, you will always be living with a full blown addict and expect nothing to change.
Dr. Weiss or Dr. Carnes said something catchy, ” Cells that fire together, wire together.” WOW!!! I get that. When Johnny burns his finger on the stove, he doesn’t touch it again. When boys have access to porn in their childhood and there is abuse or neglect, they find that self-medicating to objects is a powerful salve that requires no interaction but creates a shame based personality. They do it for life.
Many professionals say that the subjects SA’s are attracted to are usually repetitive of their early experiences or abuse. So Weiss tells of one teenage boy who mastubated frequently behind the barn for privacy. He wore his boots outside and looked down watching himself. This man has a cowboy boot fetish. True story. Boys who were abused by men have homosexual tendencies. Girls who suffered violence while they were sexually abused wil seek out violence as part of their acting out. When mean Grandma, who weighed 350 lbs., abused Johnny, he then sought out older women who were obese for S&M. Pain equals pleasure. Those synaptic pathways in the brain drive the behavioral associations. There is great shame for them in knowing that they are misbehaving which is part of the cycle. Shame for feeling good feelings when being molested as a child. It’s bad but it’s good. It feels good but I’m bad.
They are using MRI’s to show how the brain fires and can now prove the brain science in addiction. They are proving what NAP was saying about recovery and changing the brain pathways. I think that is the answer about the difference between occasional bad behavior and an addiction. You reinforce those pathways so that it changes your brain. Alcohol is a substance. You don’t become an alcoholic with one drink. You have to choose to drink until your body becomes dependent on the substance and you have to have the booze to maintain your addiction. With behavioral addictions, like gambling and sex, their own brains create the substances that give the high and they only have to recall an experience to get their fix. I do believe that this is also the way that it changes our DNA and is then passed on down to our children. So, a child with an alcoholic parent does have a predispositon for an addiction in his DNA. On a personal note, science proves the scriptural truth that the sins of the father are passed down generation to generation.
Carnes in one of his youtube clips talks about the tsunami of SA’s coming through the internet use of porn with this upcoming generation. Ditto on all the comments about the narcissist society and all the kids left to themselves. I think we need to educate everyone we can and be the examples our kids and grands need to become good people.
B-trayed said her husband said he didn’t think anyone would marry him. He hates himself. That is what my husband has told me. He hates himself and knows he is flawed but he cannot hold all the self contempt, so he turns it outward on others and himself.
My H has talked with me about his multiple addictions in the past few days. On triggers, he said that he has this voracious hole inside him and whenever he feels bad about anything, he would buy something or drink or work to accomplish something so he feels good. His addictives behaviors escalated out of control the past five years. He started hiding purchases and it was nonstop. It could be anything that made him feel bad, if I had an opposing opinion, if I had a what he thought was a disapproving look, if he was feeling old or lonely because the kids are gone now. Anything that made him feel disrespected, which is crazy in itself. he’s behaved so disgracefully but I’m not supposed to notice. Ummm. OK.
I’ve thought it’s intersting too about the different kinds of SA acting out behaviors. Mine is so shy and quiet that he is a hide watch porn and masturbate kind. Where, Lori’s thought he was Don Juan and was hustling all over town. It seems that their personalities and natures corresponds with their behaviors.
Katt – Yours says he doesn’t have a type? Mine has never admitted to a type either. He just wants to have that physical touch and release. He just wants to be loved by a woman and doesn’t feel he ever will be because he felt he could never get his mothers attention or love. So his soul hole is his desperate desire to be loved. He wants sex to be close for him, not for me. That’s why he told me when he was acting out with porn that he wanted to be with me. And when I told him I couldn’t be sexual with him he told me it felt like his mother abandoning him. I strongly suspect and so does our counselor that he was abused but he hasn’t disclosed that yet. It would be the missing piece of the puzzle but I have the whole picture anyway.
This is long enough.
The armchair psychologist,
Debora
Wow Debora, what you put together and wrote was brilliant! Explains and summarizes the whole picture. Very helpful! nap
Debora – You hit the nail on the head! I don’t think anyone could have said it or described it as well as you did.
deb you said “He just wants to be loved by a woman and doesn’t feel he ever will be because he felt he could never get his mothers attention or love” this is my partner. over the last few years it all i am. i tell him all the time i feel and fit in his life as his mother. another point ive made wih him is i think he hates woman with me his actions are hate not love, he also seems to think i should forgive or better put forget what he has done and still does. he seems to belive in his head hat if i give any sign of not being pissed off, he feels everything is just perfect. that all that hes done is over and done with. and life can go on
Katt, This is exactly my H. He told me he loves/hates women because he wanted the love of a woman that he could never have. So he hates them because they hurt him and he transfers that possessive love/hate on all his intimate relationships. He told me that is why he did porn because it is ‘hate women” “anger at women” because he could never measure up. My H also has the smooth it all over thing. If he can avoid going to his place of pain and addressing his true feelings, he’ll do it. They cannot or do not want to face their feelings and core self. It is too embarrassing and scary. My H used a variety of tactics to avoid that disclosure; anger, niceness, gifts, denial, avoidance, busyness, lying, blameshifting, deflecting…he’s a master and has used these techniques since a young boy to protect himself. If he can get me to pretend everything is OK and go along to get along, he is good and I am dying. I know where you are at.
Love, Debora
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