Working it out?

SD, I was the happiest I’ve ever been in my life when I discovered it was all a lie. Never in my wildest imagination did I dream he was capable of such deception, betrayal, and perversion. Five years later, I’ve been in and out of the swamp so many times my head spins continually. I divorced him two years ago and, currently, we’re looking at a 30-page prenup, because I’m actually considering signing back up for this shit. Maybe the only two things that ARE finally clear to me are that 1) these guys are FUBAR. Seriously, don’t expect normal behavior, and 2) if you stay with them, make sure youre protected financially and set clear boundaries about how you will be treated.

Now that I think about it, it’s really just one basic concept that’s clear: WE must protect, defend, and heal ourselves, because they are insane.

March, wait…maybe I misunderstood…are you signing up again with someone other than your exSA? A new person?

Someone pm’d me several days ago and asked me where I am now in all this, and I couldn’t even respond. I was planning to post an update, starting a new thread, but here I am, sneaking it in incrementally, tucked here and there among other messages.

I’ll say as much as I can muster for now and add more as I can–or in response to questions.

As many of you know, I started dating this summer, joining eHarm and Match (Snatch, as I call it, cause that’s all anyone is looking for). I had several disastrous dates and a couple of really nice ones where I felt no attraction. JoAnn’s Don Juans look much the same as the matches I was getting. Men over 50 are mostly gross. I am 50, very fit and active, and not ready to slow down at all. I mountain bike, kayak, etc. It’s hard to find a match my age or older. In the middle of this agonizing process….going to lunch with someone who turned out to be ANOTHER sex addict…going out with a man who sent me a manifesto for our life together after dating two weeks…getting strung along in a crushing romantic episode that seemed to be going somewhere until he rejected me due to my lovely herpes (something I disclosed date 1): “Just can’t get past it,” says he after several awesome dates, long email exchanges, etc…

All the while, Greg is going nuts, can’t stand that I’m dating, makes more promises, finally goes to the partner trauma workshop with Minwalla….

Going back to the summer and my angry posts, I believe once I processed that anger and grief I came to a new footing. That murderous rage was necessary, part of my giving up the past. I learned, too, that I can live without him, that I can feel peace without him. And he learned that too.

We enjoy the same things. I know he loves the kids. I’m pretty sure he loves me, or thinks he does. I have some strong boundaries and insurances in place. I’m willing to gamble. If I lose, I’ll get 3/4 of everything he has or will have. If I win, I get my life back. Not the life I wanted. Not the one I dreamed of. Not one I’d wish on anyone. Pathetic, I know.

Ill have more money, too, and not have to worry from paycheck to paycheck.

That’s all I gotz for now.

I am scared for you March and Trish, and still kind of awed at your ability to believe and hope. If only the recovered SAs could be yours.

Hi March Darling, you don’t have to tell me. I already know whenever you are really quiet you are with him. 😉

Well, putting the fact that he is NOWHERE near good enough for you aside…at least you have given the other side of the fence a try? There is no point in pretending it ends up all wine and roses because at our age it may not? I have this theory that we can handle our husband’s oldness …as we grew old with them. But the new guys….shocking I know. Anyway, back to you. Here is how I see it. We have two choices at our age. Stay or go. You can stay and still have some kind of happiness or security in your life but I doubt he loves you or loves anyone. He is probably not capable of love but he likely has a need that you meet. I believe this. I don’t think ANY of these assholes are morphing into loving husbands anytime in our lifetimes. So I will say to you what I have said to Lisa, Daisy, Bev, Trish, myself and a few others. IF you can really accept what he is and live with it, then you can take whatever good he may have to offer- in your case an active partner and some extra financial security- then you can focus on your own life and try to make it as good as you can. This is VERY different than living in false hope waiting for the next pervert move to break your heart. I think it will not work until you give up on his recovery and accept the reality of what he has to offer. To me, that risk to your mental health is just too high. So it isn’t a simple life or even an easy life, because living with walls around your feelings takes it’s own kind of toll. But it isn’t the Hell that loving them is either? There is a certain freedom in being out of that vice. There are many elements that make up a life. Having a partner is one of them. We have a fairytale notion of what that will mean. Many of us knew all along that something was wrong but some of us bought the Cinderella ending hook, line and sinker. We have paid dearly for believing their story. Now you look at the whole of your life (children, work, friends,hobbies, passions, health and either living alone or with a man) and try to figure out how you can best put it back together in some useable fashion. It is a difficult but necessary choice. I believe if you are young, you should get out as soon as possible. I believe if they are abusive OR you cannot contain them with boundaries, you should get out as soon as possible. I believe if it is destroying your soul to stay with them, you should get out as soon as possible. If none of the above apply to you (and the soul one is not easily answered) then you can consider staying in a new kind of marriage. One where you don’t have any illusions and where you have the upper hand. Know that by doing that….you MAY miss out on finding the love of your life. Or you may not. IF only we could know that in advance? IF only we had known who they were? But ‘if only’s” are just wishes and “once a upon a time” does not exist in the land of the SA/PD. I have the greatest respect for you and your keen brain. If you want to try to reinvent your own fairytale, go ahead, March. But make yourself the heroine and never mix up your knights and dragons. 😉 I wish all things good for you.

Love Karen

Okay Dear March ( you opened the door a crack) 🙂

I agree with Daisy and Karen. How’s that for helpful?

My real concern is that I think that you truly love him. The really love him, not the “I Can’t Do Any Better So WTF” love, not even the “I Have Loved Him So Long and Don’t Know What Else To Do” love. I think you love him heart and soul and body. That is magical but in your case it can be deadly too.

If you need to try again then I support you 100%. I even understand your reasoning, after all I am with my H for some of the very same reasons……

Good luck whichever way you decide and I am always in your corner. Love You Girl 🙂

Just remember: There’s no I in Team, but there’s a YOU in Fuck You.

They may even become more sensible?

For sure!!!

When I reflect on whether or not it was worth it given how much I suffered and the ongoing PTSD……..I don’t have an answer except now that most of the emotional pain has subsided, I think so. Ultimately, federal law (Spousal Equity Act) provided some financial protection. Thank God.

I don’t have much now, but I do have healthcare coverage and will have income beyond social security in my old age. That’s a lot.

March, wishing you the best. Glad you are protecting yourself legally, financially. And, I fear for you.

Sister, you’re preaching to the choir. Say Amen and pass the collection plate. $$$$$$ 🙂 $$$$$$

March, I wish you well in your decision to stay. As most of us know, it is a complicated decision and different for every one of us. For myself, I know that if I stay (and my prior decision to stay, which I do not regret, even with a second discovery), I want to feel good about the decision, about myself and my integrity in making that decision, and also feel good about the man I am choosing to stay with. That’s fundamental for me, and right now, a fairly high bar to reach. I understand why others stay for financial reasons (and I’m currently in an in-house separation in large part because my attorney advised me to do that for financial reasons until I am certain I want to divorce), but I can not imagine staying long term for financial reasons if I hated the guy. Actually, I couldn’t imagine staying for any reason if I thought the guy was insane or FUBAR. I couldn’t imagine staying if I thought he was acting out or didn’t value me or the relationship. I’d have to believe he was redeemed in some way that felt good to me to have him in my life. And I’d have to experience him in that way on a consistent basis. And the rub is that it can be very, very hard to know for sure that they are redeemed and healthy because so many SA’s are practiced and competent deceivers. So yes, choices like the one you are making are always a gamble, and you can put all the legal and financial protections in place, but you will not have a 100% guarantee that he’ll be what he promises to be or even what you experience him to be. The emotional protections (for example, tellling yourself you don’t care about him and acting like that some of the time) IMHO, are problematic for me. I can not live with a man that I keep myself emotionally distant and disconnected from. I couldn’t be sexual with a man I was emotionally distant and disconnected from or who i thought was FUBAR or insane. So I would have to open myself emotionally again, I’d have to be willing to take that risk with the only real guarantee I could have is that I will survive whatever happens and be OK. Others have made different choices, but for me, I would not want to resume a relationship with my h unless I felt good about him and about our relationship and that I could be emotionally open to him, all the while knowing that even if I was wrong, I would be OK. Otherwise, I wouldn’t go back into it. Others can see stuff from the outside we sometimes can’t see from the inside, but the opposite is also true. Nobody knows your heart and your relationship the way you do.

Oh, and one thing I’ve learned for sure in the past several years is that I DON’T KNOW what I’ll do in whatever circumstances until those circumstances happen. The devil rides on the backs of the certain.