- This topic has 23 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 13 years, 6 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Boy, today really set me back. Steve and I went to my therapist because his is out of town.
We talked about his lieing and acting out-not disclosing, etc.
This woman talked entirely different in front of Steve and I than when we are alone. She said, that because Steve does not do well with conflict, gets angry, defensive, PA,etc.- I am contributing to the problem. In otherwords, if he lies and I confront him if I catch him in a lie or not disclosing than that is why he lies. She told me I am sabotoging the relationship!
Well, mfg, I was under the impression that part of recovery for an SA is disclosing honestly about slips, triggers, acting out, etc., and that, we as spouses, should confront when we know there is deception and that part of they’re recovery is disclosing lovingly without the bullshit defensiveness. And to tell me I am sabatoging the relationship because Steve can’t deal with conflict put the frosting on the cake.
I have done nothing but given my entire self to him emotionally – even when lieing and deception continues. I have given him praise when he is doing well, and called it to his attention when he does not. The ONLY time I have ever gotten angry myself is with the continual lieing.
I guess we are supposed to be passive little women and not say a word just because our husband’s make a conscious decision to lie. My ONLY expectation for him has been to tell the truth.
My counselor did say a few things to him about how important it is to tell the truth, initiate intimacy, disclose, etc. But I came out of the session with no support from her whatsoever! She said to me, “You appear angry, and that I am not giving you support today.” – Something like that. I confronted her right there in front of Steve and told her she talks entirely different when we are alone. She did not reply to that. She also said to Steve that he can and will recover and get better. At least Terri, his last therapist did not give him that assurance – how can you??? She also told me she want me to stay away from S.O.S.-that it has been her experience these kinds of sights have a negative opinion on recovery and re-enforce that. I asked her if she had ever been on the sight, and she said, “No.” I told her maybe she should sign in and find out.
Anyway, never so enraged in my life. No empathy for what the lieing does to me – only that I should not call this poor boy’s attention to anything because he can’t handle conflict. I guess I make him lie!!
I say BS to all of it! Just had to vent guys. Would love to hear your opinions on this one.Hi Sharron,
Did I read this right or am I losing my mind? This is YOUR counselor feeding him this BS??? WTF? And, to suggest that you not seek support from others who have walked in your shoes….hopefully, she was just having an off day.
I can testify that it’s the lying that did more damage than the actual acting out itself. The deceit that when on for so damn long that caused the most hurt. I can overcome the damage done from the porn use and the affairs, but the lying…that’s a whole different thing.
When is your next appointment? I hope soon so you can talk to her about this one…
(Sorry, I’m a bit bitchy today – rough day in my house)
Hugs to you,
SS
Hi Sharron,
Will the real therapist please stand up. Geeeez! A good therapist is a rare find. Years ago, a therapist I had for a while asked me to invite my h so we could talk about our marriage. I thought okay. When we got there together and walked in the room, I didnt recognize her. She was all dressed up in a RED dress, kinda split on the side, leg dangling, red lipstick and nail polish, smelled pretty. I swear they were therapy flirting the whole session and I was never asked one question. When we left I felt really dumpy because I wasnt wearing a RED dress. He said, “I really like her!” I never went back. Bi*ch!!!eeewww… how gross! and I am sorry, but I do not believe that a straight male sex addict should ever be seen by a woman, unless she’s at least 85.
Sharron, i’m so sorry that she said all of those things to you. She’s an idiot. The only thing I will say in her defense, is that no man wants to be told that he’s lying, even if he is. And of course, it erodes the relationship, but if he IS lying, (and I believe that psychodude IS), and you’re still with him, then its a pretty dysfunctional relationship to begin with. But, that is your choice to make. Again. stay with him, if you can find a way to make your peace with it, but stop, stop, stop trying to fix him. Its impossible.
It won’t help. It won’t help you to cope (obviously) and it won’t help him to get better either. She’s obviously been completely hoodwinked by him; how very hurtful that must be for you. If she’s helping you alone, fine… but now it seems that the trust is eroded which is unfortunate. But, whatever you do… please stop getting “therapy” with Steve. Get a pedicure instead. much more beneficial. 😉
I’m kind of funny about sharing my therapist. I would never have him come to one of my sessions. My therapy session is for me. His therapist is for him. I don’t go to his either. When it comes time to do couples therapy we will see another therapist, not his, not mine.
However, what happened with your therapist is outrageous. It makes me wonder if she was ever really on your side this whole time. I mean, I know they don’t take sides, but you go to see her to help you deal with trauma, was she helping you all this time? Did she ever tell you in the past that you were part of the problem? So bizzare. I would be angry too. Are you going to continue to see her? I think I would start over with a different therapist. Although the thought of that, in my opinion is a pain in the ass. Having to start the whole story over from the beginning to get the therapist caught up.
Watcha gonna do? Do you know?
Love, CB
Stillstanding-This is my therapist feeding him this bullshit. He only went with me today because his therapist is out of town. Both of the therapist’s are personal friend’s however, and share the same philosophy. Sorry it’s rough around your house today-thanks for the feedback.
NAP – Can relate to that – Steve thinks I find fault in any therapist who does not agree with him. WRONG. Just want a therapist who doesn’t always take the SA’s side.
LEXIE-Thanks for replying to me when you have so much on your’e plate right now. You are a doll! I always just call it to his attention in a calm manner. I think we have a right to disclosure if the fucker is lieing. I agree – this has always been a dysfunctional relationship. I was trying to work with her on insight as to why I stay in, but I won’t be going back.
She did nothing to support me, and it gave Steve a very good excuse to keep lieing if he can blame his lieing and anger on me. It is a conflict resolution issue with him.Any conflict, and he lies.
CBSlife- No. she never told me in the past she felt I was part of the problem-talked entirely differently when Steve was there. Part of his recovery should be disclosing honestly to me when he fucks up, but is not able to do that. Then, I am told I am part of the problem. No, he needs to quit his fucking lieing.This is a personal friend of mine to boot – I will be finding another therapist.Actually, I have more experience in counseling than she does-she is just starting her practice, and sexual addiction is not her area of expertise. As JoAnn told me a while back, it is not ethical for a therapist to tell a client they will recover. Bad news all away around.
Thanks for your support everyone. I am really down today about all this, and Steve, of course, makes it sound like I am picking her apart. Bullshit again. She is just agreeing with him. My God, the poor fellow is lieing because I contront him. His anger gets out of control and projects it one me. Damn it – JUST QUIT THE LIEING, and there would be no confrontation.
LOVE TO YOU ALL. I really needed the support today.Hi Sharron,
Ahh this brings back memories. Last year I wanted to set up a healing seperation agreement, and i wanted to has out the details with my therapist present. I figured my therapist would be an advocate for me, and that is what i wanted and needed.So we show up for the session. She starts going over all of the stuff in the past, his recover, how he is doing, basically spends the whole time hashing out stuff, again, and we never got to one word of the seperation agreement. She/we never got to what i needed done. I could not stand one word that came of of my sa pompus smug mouth as he sat there talking about how hard he is working and how much trouble he is having for me to see the progress he has made. At this point i am about to blow a gasket.
We left, i was furious, and we got home and i told him how much i hated him, and we are doing a seperation agreement without an agreement and i don;t want you to come back. And that was that plus recalling finding a prostitutes call card in wallet…that was it.
And the SA even said this to me “sometimes the stuff we don;t want to hear, is what we need to hear most”. Gauge me.
Anyway we come full circle. I was enraged on the day, i felt she was completely wrong, that she threw me under the bus per say, and almost sided with my SA. I almost did not go back. My thoughts were that he is not in recovery, he is a very good liar and faker…and i do not trust him ONE BIT. One year later, SA goes to therapy 1-2 times a month and to 12 step once a month. Now she has changed her toon.
Short of the story is…i was right. I was and never will get what i needed from my SA, and am better off to have let that all go. Soemtimes Sharron you will be the ONLY one that knows what is best for you. You will be the only to decide what is right for you. And when soemthing rubs you really the wrong way, i think it is not right for you. You need to listen to yourself and do what you need for you.
This therapist has not liked us all along. But we only encourage you to do what is best for you. And sadly, many therapist will tell you to look the other way and have 100% faith in your h; however that is assumeing you are dealing with someone who is NORMAL. Someone who lies and has no empathy is not normal.
Love and hugs to you,
FloraYa Flora-that is precisely my point. For a therapist to tell me I am sabatoging the relationship by confronting him in his triggering and lieing is ludicrous. He is the one with the issue – not me. He makes the conscious decision to lie, and if I am feeling the need to confront him rationally, he needs to deal with his inability to not handle conflict and take it out on me. Secondly, she told him he will recover from this-totally not ethical. I am her client. If she was planning to do a turn about of what we privately been talking about by ourselves in sessions should have been discussed with me prior to the session. Ya, basically, she is telling me to be passive, not confront him because this makes him lie more. Well, tough shit. Get over the lieing, and there would not be the necessity of calling him on his lieing and triggers. His therapist told him last week to be brutally honestwith me. Two days later he is telling another lie. NOT MY ISSUE. If he can’t handle conflict and he lies as a result of it, they should be working with him to resolve the issue – not projecting onto me that he lies because I confront him. Grow up and be a big boy!
I am very negative and hurt today – sorry if I keep rambling on. If Steve’ therapist is going to continue with this same mind set, we do not stand a chance. They should tackle the problem with him and help him understand if he did not lie, there would be no confrontations. I guess these therapists want us to sit back and take all this shit without commenting or bringing up a constructive conversation to comment I am seeing him do it. Instead, I get rage from him.
Steve is clueless about how much he has hurt me with the lieing, and comes back with I tell the truth some of the time, and you do not believe me. WHY SHOULD I? He may have lied two days prior.
Thanks for the feedback. Love and hugs to you as well. I don’t know what I would do with out you all-it is my lifeline.NAP – I forgot to tell you. Steve’s 1st therapist was tall, blond, and dressed to kill. She kept sitting there playing with her hair – you know twirling it around her fingers. It was very seductive. Steve triggered on her two or three times.
How in the hell does someone find an ethical sexual addiction counselor? I have been in the field for years, and do not know of one who really knows they’re stuff. I have even had one colleague of mine (Psychiatrist) tell me he didn’t want to deal with sex addicts because they are too manipulative and he didn’t need to listen to they’re games in session. Think I will just continue on my own and handle it the best I can. I am usually pretty right on about his addiction, but being emotionally involved have not made very good decisions in staying in this long. Something will have to give – he will either have to get on board, respect my boundaries, and tell the truth, or I will just have to get out. My nerves are shot!!Sharron i just reread what I wrote and it sounded kinda bitchy so I wanted to apologize. I didn’t mean it that way. I can’t say that my relationship isn’t dysfunctional either… in fact its getting wackier by the minute.
I’m glad that you’re leaving that woman… and I still stand by what I say. A straight male sex addict should not be seen by an attractive young woman, no matter what. (Well, maybe if she has a hazmat suit on…lol) I don’t care how qualified she is.
Actually, whatever I have on my plate has been there all along, and you know what? Its actually a fucking relief in some ways. FINALLY. it is ALL making complete sense.
all of it.
love,
L
PS: one of my husband’s long time (supposedly platonic, but who knows anymore?) girlfriends who’s married… Is a VERY attractive, petite, busty, looooooong blond hair– SEX THERAPIST.
not.
Lexie – I am so glad you are finally seeing it. I need to do the same – recognize that this addiction is going to go on for the rest of his life. You were not sounding bitchy! It is a dysfunctional relationship – dysfunctional because it is his issue, not mine. Dysfunctional because he can’t tell the truth, and then gets angry and defensive with me. Now the big question is what do I do about it??? It is driving me crazy.
I think you have your answer. No hope in your’e marriage. Get out-cut your losses, and be happy. I just hope I don’t continue in this fascade and ruin my life. He wants to change, but at 68, it ain’t gonna happen, and I don’t think I can be continually humiliated by him constantly objectifying the young things – always looking for that fantasy woman that doesn’t exist. What am I, chopped liver.
Lexie, we both, need to be happy and I think for you is cutting yourself free. That is probably what I should do, as well, and I am going to work on it, myself, why I can’t cut loose. Love you-hang in there.Sharron, I’ve probably said this before… but i was a victim of extreme cruel, sadistic child abuse and the fact that i’m still alive is nothing short of a miracle.
i vowed that i would never ever let a man abuse me, no matter what. I thought that i had married a man who was the opposite of my father… but you know what?
he was just non-violent version of my father, but just as abusive.
and i’m in a horrible situation. but i can’t stay. two days ago i could, but now i can’t. i can’t. i can’t. i can’t.
lexie you wrote this- I thought that i had married a man who was the opposite of my father… but you know what?
he was just non-violent version of my father, but just as abusive.
i to live with these feeling, i find this to be the hardest part for me. when i met my partner i let all my guards down, now i cant seem to find any way to protect if you will, myself. i always had a way of bouncing now i brake with each new thing and as i piece myself back together i get weaker because of it. i sometimes feel like i am losing me more and more. im so very sorry you are in this place inside you right now, know that you are in my heart and im here for you
much love kattHi All,
Ya know the expression one day at a time, addict anonymous groups use it. For them its one day (hour, minute) at a time until they can make it day after day, year after year. That statement for me, as a soon to ex spouse of an addict, is that i will work together with you on this…until i cannot do it anymore. And you will know when that happens, you will have reached your threshold of what you can possibly tolerate, live through or not tolerate. But there gets to be a point where we just snap, and enough is enough and we cannot bear one more day in that existance.This is what one day at a time means for me.
Hi Sharron,
loving the strength in your postings!! Thanks so much for sharing what’s happening in your own experience!
And I am sorry about the stupid therapist junk. I’m beginning to wonder about our special needs ever being met with honesty and courage. No wonder we waster so much time on the SA story!!!! It’s do damn hard to get anyone to listen to ours.
sharron, we’re listening to your story. And I’m really glad to you didn’t fall down the rabbit hole your therapist opened up. Way to go, woman.
D.
ps. In case you didn’t notice…I’m back.Thanks Diane – but I had to listen to my husband yell and rant and tell me how I find fault with a therapist if they do not agree with me. WRONG – I found fault with her because she tells me I am sabatoging the relationship. NO – he lies! That is the sabatoge. Oh well, I’m over it today. Just not going back to her. Thank you for the positives. I really don’t think anyone, therapist, friends, family, totally understand what it is like to live with an SA. We never get the support we need – it is always about them. I can’t say that about my sister and son, however, they are totally supportive.
Glad you are back – I always welcome your input.thanks for the welcome back, Sharron,
I was reading one of your posts on someone else’s thread and wanted to underline what you said—it was about how we always think the nice side of our SA is the “real” side, but it’s really the “dark” side that is their real self. That’s a hard but pretty solid observation. Only they can change the truth of that. But we have to be so careful about not slipping into that “con” again. Their “nice” is not their default setting. That’s why it doesn’t last.Love your picture btw. You are beautiful. Have you noticed how beautiful all these women are?
take care,
D.Thanks Diane for the compliment on the picture. Yes, I have noticed how we are all beautiful women, and then I think how sad it is that our SA’s do not appreciate what they have.
I am past slipping into the “con” again, but still struggle with how difficult it is for me to end this nightmare.
Am getting ready to compose an E-mail to my therapist, give her a piece of my mind, and terminate my sessions with her. It might get ugly!!Hi Sharron. Deep breath. You might do her and anyone else that seeks her counsel a huge favor if you express how angry you are, but not in the manner that will just make her defensive (she’s human) and not listen to your important message. I was told it was bad news for a SA to see a woman therapist as well. My woman therapist told me that they are all master manipulators. Flora is right…sometimes only you know what is real because you live and breathe it. They (the ethical ones) are only doing the best they can to read between the lines. Love, Lylo
Ps…if you think your therapist is less than, read this blast from the past (late ’80’s). She had her own show!!
Another type of premature diagnosis is to attribute the cause of any sexual problem to the partner. For example, years ago a woman wrote to Dr. Ruth Westheimer (1987), who had a sex therapy newspaper column, complaining that her husband could hardly wait for her to leave the house so that he could begin watching pornographic videos, and that several times she had returned home early and found him masturbating to a porn movie. Meanwhile, her husband was rarely interested in sex with her. Dr. Ruth’s diagnosis was that the wife was sexually boring, and she recommended that the wife work on becoming more exciting sexually by dressing more provocatively and increasing her sexual repertoire and her sexual availability. Another therapist, upon hearing a woman’s complaints about her husband’s interest in pornography, told her that all she needed was a more enlightened attitude about pornography, including joining her husband in viewing the pictures and films. Meanwhile, her husband’s preferred sexual outlet, one he spent engaged in for many hours a week, was masturbating to pornography. The wife had, in the past, agreed to experiment with various sexual activities with her husband, but he was not particularly interested in relational sex (Schneider et al., 1998).
First of all… welcome back Diane!!! I saw in another post that you are planning on writing a book! how awesome and i’m sure that it’ll be fantastic reading!
For Sharron. You are absolutely 1000% right, but I think the point is that Steve doesn’t KNOW that he is lying. I’m sure that he is, but if he doesn’t realize it, and you are telling him that he’s lying when he thinks he’s being truthful, then yes… you could be viewed as being the “saboteur”, but of course, its the other way around. That is why I call it “mindfuck”. There is no winning. there is no logic. there is no rhyme or reason or sense. All one can do is spin their wheels round and round in the shit… So, in addition to never getting anywhere, its quite messy and gross. That’s why therapy with you and him is a no no. it will never ever work.
The therapist is a twit and yes, has drunk Steve’s Kool-aid. Quite frankly, I agree with Lylo. Just dump her. no explanation. You are done. good bye. next? IF she happens to call you back to find out what happened, then if you feel like it, maybe gently explain to her that psychodude is a sociopath and he’s such a superb liar that he even believes his own lies and therefore you understand where she’s coming from, because he is quite deceiving, but you need someone with more expertise in personality disorders and the realities of sexual addictions and to understand that the sabotage is coming from him, because he is not being truthful to anyone, including himself.
Love, Lexie
Hi Lexie- We only saw my therapist together this one time because Steve’s is on vacation. The two therapist’s are very good friends and am sure think very similar in treatment modalities.
I will say that my therapist told me Steve probably does not always know when he lies, but Steve admits he does most of the time. I can tell you with total assurety that he knows exactly what he is doing. The only time he might not know he is lieing would be when he dissociates, and I have only seen him do that 3-4 times. When he does, he doesn’t remember it – loses time. He got tearful in the session, so am sure she fell for that hook line and sinker.
My therapist is also a colleague and good friend of mine.
Thanks Lylo-I will tone it down, I always write a dandy to get my anger out, and then re-write and am very professional about it. I loved your stories- yes, there are some real wacko’s out there. Being in the field, I have meant many of them. I could write a book.
Lexie – I hope you are feeling better. I know you are going through so much right now, and I worry about you.
Gotta go – Here comes Steve.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.