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Wonder if he was tracking your cycle too? Like maybe wondering if you’d get pregnant or something?
I agree… weird!!!
Maybe he was trying to justify his actions. Like, okay, we only had sex 3 times this month, so if the normal male has sex 3 times a week, I can masturbate 12 more times now. ??? Creepy weird.
Just when you think you’ve heard it all!!
Kim–I am so glad you’re so technical… and easy to understand! Thanks for putting in the time to write out the directions.
Silver–looking forward to that list!! And, totally commiserating over the move with you. I LOATHE moving. It is the worst thing ever. I hate how empty rooms look. Hate having to be the one to pack it all up too. Can you put on some jammin’ music to help you along? I made an F-U cd the other day using some of the song suggestions I found on here and have been blasting it! Lately, I’ve been going through old pictures and scrapbook type things, trying to get them all scanned or taken out of the house while SA is at work. So, I’ve been doing my share of reliving memories and raging against having to sort out my precious belongings into “keep forever” “keep for now” “trash that looks valuable but isn’t so leave for SA to go through” “scan to make sure it’s really, really safe” It’s exhausting. And I sorted my fall decorations into two different categories: which ones I definitely had to take with me (ie, things my DD had made) vs simply decorative crap that I like but could live without. And I’ll be doing the same thing with Christmas decor. All 20 boxes of it. I can’t even imagine trying to move right now… but I know that’s coming soon too. God, I hate them for all they’ve done to us.
for-now–don’t wear yourself out trying to figure him out. It’s like trying to find a cure for cancer. You simply cannot do it. It’s too complex and people have been trying for years. Like others have said, figure out what YOU need. So many of us are financially dependent and can’t leave. But we’re plotting and working toward that end goal. Is that what you want?
I still take pictures of SA’s texts to his various women. Why? Not because I am checking up on him, because truthfully, it doesn’t do me a lot of good since we’re not talking about it at all. (I’m one of the ones who haven’t confronted my SA yet.) I do it for blackmail purposes. I know it doesn’t prove infidelity in SC courts, but I think I’ll be able to scare the bejeezus out of him. So every week or so, I take some pictures. It’s more a check-list that I follow than a checking-on-his-actions thing.
Hope your talk goes the way you want it to tonight! Keep us posted!!
Love,
PaulaHi, Patricia!
I’m a newbie here and often find typing out my stories/questions/comments is so hard. I can’t find the right words. I’m easily flustered. It seems like so much work.
And it seems so unfair that we should have to shoulder the burden to do the healing for something we didn’t do, didn’t ask for, don’t want.
But healing is important. And I find that every day that I spend here, at SOS, is vital to my healing. Many days I just read and cry. I don’t even try to comment, much less post a question or concern. But some days, I do feel able to put together a thought and hope that I can help someone else. And I think it does. And I know that the support I needed was here, is here, and isn’t going anywhere.
So sorry you needed this site, but so glad you found it too!
Love,
Paula
Lynn–
First, I am so sorry the disclosure yesterday and the meeting with the attorney were not at all what you needed. It’s such a trapped helpless feeling–I know, I’m there too. But having company doesn’t make the misery any better… it just means that there are more of us in the same boat.
Just a few thoughts.
I’m betting he wrote out all the details of your relationship because it turned him on. Reliving his conquests, etc, trips his trigger. Maybe, in some sort of way, it gave him a feeling on control too. But, the fact that it might be on his work computer gives me hope that it could be used against him. !!!
I also think that you shouldn’t erase all of those copies you made. Why? It definitely shows a different side of him, one that you can show to the judge when you need to. This side is predatory and calculating. It does objectify your relationship and I think it could be a powerful tool for your divorce attorney. Don’t let it humiliate you. Those therapists have seen and heard it all. They won’t hold anything against you. Promise.
Did you ask the lawyer about the continuity thing? I’m betting that will be a good thing in your favor. You quit a good job to move here and marry him… are now trying to go back to school… and he’s doing this. Certainly that has to look favorably on you, trying to make something good happen from all of this.
I’ll be sending good thoughts your way!!
Love, Paula
Well, it appears we are back to the DD sleeping with me and SA sleeping in her room.
And, for the time being, I am okay with it. It was truly all I could do earlier to stop crying, so I just had to hold it together until DD went to bed. Now, I’m sitting here, typing away, and he’s watching tv. There’s a strained silence between us. I think we’ve said two or three sentences to each other all night. I could care less.
And CERTAINLY believe me that I DO NOT think my daughter is in danger. We’ve had that conversation before and I don’t think she is AT ALL in any danger. I would not be here if I did.
However, I, like many of you, have realized that my SA is NOT the person I thought he was and have discovered that I believe him to be capable of much more than I ever imagined. So, I don’t pretend to know all that he is capable of. But I’ve not found child porn or any thing similar (remember, he was the one with the 40+, 50+, and 60+ magazines) so I think all will be okay.
I do agree that he shouldn’t be here with DDs friends. I will make sure that from now on, that doesn’t happen. Sad but true. And that is one of the reasons she isn’t allowed to go to some friends’ homes for sleepovers. Because a father is there.
Thanks for the advice ladies. I still have to figure out the long-term sleeping arrangements but having tonight settled took some weight off… even if I didn’t really do anything.
Isn’t it sad/funny/tragic how the smallest things can get us all worked up sometimes?
I know, march, I know. It isn’t my problem but it is. I don’t want him messing in my “office”/craft room/storage room. I have things the way I want them and don’t want him moving it all around.
And we don’t have a guest bedroom. So it’s not that easy. I hate it. I don’t want to make his problems mine, truly. But I am struggling with this because in essence all of the rooms are “taken.”
And yes, I know, he brought this on himself. I know.
But now he’s messing with my life and my house and my rooms and I feel strongly that **I** should get to decide how and where he is going to continue to mess with my life and my house, instead of having him force himself into whatever corner he chooses.
That doesn’t sit well with me. I’m tired of letting him live his life the way he wants. And making me deal with the fall-out. Damn it! This is a decision **I** need to get to make!!
Kim, I’ve also been checking into the dadsdivorce.com website. It’s run by a couple of militant dads-rights lawyers and the things those guys (the members) talk about… how to document, how to manipulate… all of it has been so beneficial to me to see how the other side thinks. I will also check into divorcesource…but not talk to any men there! 🙂
Sucks that we’re all having to deal with all of this mess, but it’s nice to have resources to rely on!
OH HO! I just remembered what I forgot to say in my earlier post. Probably one of the most important, reassuring things that I was told by each attorney. In a marriage (or even in a living-together situation), there is no such thing as privacy! NONE. What’s yours is his and vice versa. You can snoop to your heart’s content. The only thing is, if you have to break in to his computer by hacking his password, into his email by typing in the password (even if you know it), or crack open a safe because it’s locked…. anything you find out that way will not be usable in a court of law. Something about wiretapping laws, etc, that makes that type of evidence disallowed in court.
But if he gave you the drive, take all the info you can. If he left his cell phone sitting out where you could access it, look at it. Take pictures of all of everything you find.
If there’s no password, there’s no expectation of privacy. At all.
So what was the first thing I did as soon as I got home from the attorney’s office? Put passwords on EVERYTHING! 😀
Go through ALL of his shit. Every paper clip, every note tossed in the trash. (look through the trash/recycle file on his computer) But do it when he’s not looking. Don’t let him know you’re doing it. Especially if you’re sticking around. Just let him relax and let you find stuff. He’ll bury himself soon enough. And you’ll benefit.
No expectation of privacy. I LOVE THAT. Oh, silly men. How little they really know.
Pam,
Have you consulted with any of the attorneys in town? In my area (SC), every attorney I called had a consultation fee, ranging from $75 to $150. Not applied to the retainer fee of $2500-3500. But, both of the ones I met with (one much better than the other) said that I would be able to ask for my SA to pay for my attorney’s fees and that a judge would definitely consider that. It would work as a rebate back to me, after the case was closed. So I had to have the money upfront for the retainer. When I indicated that was a problem, the great attorney told me that most women didn’t have the money, that they borrowed it from a family member. Now, I don’t have any one that I could ask for that money from, but I wanted to toss that idea to you in case you might. Also, know that both of the attorneys I met with know have me on their records so if he called to make an appointment with either of them, they wouldn’t accept him as a client (conflict of interest). So, if you can, scrape together whatever you need to and have a consultation with your super attorney. Make sure your SA can’t get him! And, that way too, if you needed a good attorney quickly, you’d already have established a relationship with him. When I called to make my appointments, the fantastic attorney had a waiting time of 3 weeks. The bad one, 1 day. I decided that even if I didn’t have the retainer money yet, it made sense to have the good one lined up for when/if I needed her.
Sending positive thoughts to you!
Paula
Ahhhh, the waning hours of my anniversary….spending it alone…. certainly not the way I expected it to be going when I married him 15 years ago.
But I have done a lot of thinking over the last few days and am more determined than ever to get the heck outta Dodge. I have so many good things going on in my life. My daughter is the biggest one, but my health, my mom’s health, my friends IRL and on the computer 🙂 and I am grateful for the ability to take what I’ve learned and experienced and make it into the driving force that will inspire me to be a better role model for my daughter.
I’m not one to have regrets. I’ve made a lot of mistakes in my life and feel strongly that each one of them shaped me into the person I am today. So wishing all of this away would be contrary to that belief system. And while I’m not happy any of this happened, I’m so glad that I found out when I did… and not way farther off in the future. I’m young (enough!) to start over again. I have many interests and abilities and am going to find ways to be more productive and giving. I’m going to pursue more of my choices in life and am going to make more of my favorite things happen, instead of waiting for them to happen.
And I’m going to pretend I’m the spider, welcoming the fly. I will be letting him come back to the house tomorrow, not because he wants to, but because my daughter wants him to. And because it suits my needs. I will continue to save money, stock pile whatever needs I can anticipate for the future, and stab him with whatever sharp words I choose to use whenever my daughter’s not around. I will be planning my getaway while I plan his demise. But he won’t know it. He’ll be too wrapped up in his fantasy life that he won’t know what’s going on until it’s too late. And then I’ll laugh all the way out the door.
And if he doesn’t notice? That’s okay too, because living well is the best revenge…. and I plan on living very well indeed. On his money. With his child. Far, far away from his wretchedness.
And that, my friends, is what I (along with a very large glass of riesling) came up with tonight. Happy anniversary to me… and hopefully I can celebrate every November 28 the same way… without him!!
Yes, please, JoAnn. I am interested in this. I do not believe my husband has enough computer skill to do something to my computer, but then I never suspected him of being capable of all the things he’s done thus far. I honestly don’t know him at all. 🙁
Lynn,
did you hear from the attorney yet? As a fellow SC sufferer, I do know a few things about the divorce law here. As much as it pains me to say it, to get a divorce here you either have to be separated for a year or you have to have grounds. Adultery is one of those grounds. You have to prove both intent and opportunity. And while it seems easy, it isn’t. The attorney I consulted with (I still don’t have the $3500 retainer fee!) advised me to get a PI (another $1500!) and told me I stood a good chance of having the judge award me having him (SA) pay my court costs. Which would be good… but that comes as a rebate to me after the whole ordeal. I’d still have to pay the out of pocket costs first.
I’ve been married for 15 years and do expect some sort of spousal support. I think that a long term marriage is one of 10 years or more. However, there is what is called “continuity” and judges are very much in favor of continuing what has already been started. Meaning, if you are currently as stay at home wife homeschooling your child and have been so for a while, then there is a chance that the judge would consider that to be important to continue, and would make him pay some sort of support. As far as support for your children, I’m not so sure about that unless you can prove that he intended to care for them as his own. And if that’s the case, you can expect that he would have the option to ask for custody or placement or both. Not that support payment or not is tied to custody or placement, but you have to be careful asking for one without being willing to give up the other.
And the continuity thing goes along with your education. If that’s been started before the beginning of your proceedings, then you stand an excellent chance of SA having to fund that too. Whatever you do, don’t take out a student loan to pay for it!!
Without grounds for adultery, you will have to be separated for one year to get a no-fault divorce. SC sucks for having really bad divorce laws. And during that time, especially if you’re asking for support and he’s asking for placement/custody, then you won’t be able to move out of state without his approval.
So get your education as quickly as you can, save as much money as you can. Document, document, document as much as you can without it driving you nuts.
And get the ring. $6K out of joint funds that will be yours at the end… and you get to sell and realize the profit from! Make every purchase you can NOW before proceedings start. Before he’s even aware of what you’re doing. Pay off your car. Buy clothes for the kids now, ahead of when they’ll need them for spring. Say you’re buying them at end of the season sales. Doesn’t matter. Just buy ahead. Stock up on toiletries, detergent, towels. Stockpile and stash all the stuff you’ll need later when you do move out. Keep it off-site if possible. Buy gift cards for the grocery store or pharmacy. Stash them away in a lock box at the bank in your mom’s name. He can’t prove you bought them. Take out an extra $20 when you buy groceries. Take care of you and your kids in every way possible now so that you will be able to later on.
Hugs!
PaulaDear Heidi–
I know you didn’t mean to kick him down the stairs, but honestly, by default or divine intervention, you probably did the one thing that might have caused him to pay some respect to you. I think you can continue that process of demanding respect by finding the best attorney money can buy (his money!), by cancelling his credit cards and hotel reservations, by selling his Packers tickets on ebay for dirt cheap (surely they’ll be mailed to your house, right?) And you can find out which hotel he’s booked at, right? Of course, I wouldn’t tell him any of this. Let him drive to the game, fake tickets in hand, thinking he has hotel reservations, etc. Then find out he is essentially homeless, with every credit card he has in his wallet cancelled. No gas money. No ATM. No reservations. No game tickets. I swear, I’d bust his balls on every possible chance I had. Not kidding. And then I’d dare him to ruin my Christmas. Because if he thinks that game weekend was bad….. let him imagine the rest of his life with you directing every bad part that happens. I’d get one of those voodoo dolls and put it where he’d find it. Let him think he’s cursed. So help me, he’d never ever mess with one of your holidays again.
Sorry about the rant. I’m just a little bent outta shape about these SOBs and am ready to make some mischief!
Thanks all. I’m running out the door to pick up DD from school so I don’t have time to even think of a real answer. I haven’t given him a real answer about tomorrow. I did tell my DD that I would let him come back. Sigh.
I know that it’s a temporary solution and that I do plan on leaving at some point.
I do have the best attorney in town. Have actually considered making appointments with some of the better attorneys in neighboring towns just to keep him from being able to use them. More money is the issue.
I have to say that being kicked out with my DD would probably be the best thing he could do to me as far as a divorce in SC since that’s just not a gentlemanly thing to do!
We don’t fight at all in front of DD. I refuse to do that and mess with her head. Not fair to her at all.
Okay, I’ll be back… much later after dance and dinner. (with her, of course!)
Thank you all for these suggestions! I just made myself the most kick-ass anniversary present ever!!
And would like to add Grenade by Delilah (from the Sing-Off). It’s on Amazon and it just seems to sum up what we all would have done for our SAs… note the past tense for me. 😀
anniem, I agree with the others: this is one of the worst things that could happen. I am as lost as you are right now and feel very beaten up and abused. I don’t know how to compartmentalize things either. I’ve been a basket case since August and desperately need to find out how to do that so I can move on with my life.
JoAnne–that’s an e-book waiting to be written when you find the time!! “How to Compartmentalize Your Life Like Your SA Does… in just 7 easy steps!”
Wow, jos–
That hit me. I needed that today. Today is my 15th wedding anniversary. I never dreamed I’d be spending it here, although now that I’ve been through what I’ve been through, here is the perfect place for me.
And your statement:
“The thing about love, is you have to love yourself to love anyone else. To have a respect and a center. Perhaps that’s why by the end I didnt love you anymore. Because i no longer loved the person I had become.”
is exactly what I needed to hear today.
Thank you for taking the time to write that today. Especially today.
Love,
Paula
Thanks, Kim. Those are some great points.
I think he is stealing from his job. I have no proof of this, as pointed out by the attorney I consulted with, all I have are what might amount to bits of evidence. And, of course, as she also pointed out, I cannot go to his boss and ask if he suspects SAH of stealing, because then I would be interfering in his ability to make a living so then I wouldn’t get any potential spousal support. (yes, doing the right thing would get me penalized!)
And being that he is in retail, this is their busiest time of year, so even if his boss suspects something, he wouldn’t do anything except keep a closer eye on SAH because he needs his sales ability right now… and doesn’t need the bad press that would come from firing him. Small town politics. Of course, there is the possibility that SAH isn’t stealing. Ummm, I don’t believe that. And then there’s the possibility that his boss doesn’t know. I’d come closer to believing that. But I do hate to think he’s stupid and is getting abused like I was.
I don’t want him back in. I don’t see how I can keep him out. He didn’t want to leave. He wants all of this to go back to “normal”… but doesn’t seem to get it that his normal is everyone else’s fucked up.
I have seen that movie, but it’s been a long time. I will definitely check it out! Thanks for the suggestion and all of your advice.
Oh, gawd, Nap….
Now that I thought I had run through all the scenarios, this strikes terror in my heart. Please tell me, how did he throw you out? And are you okay?
I’m sorry if I’ve missed this somewhere, as my popping in and out of here is quite random when I have both the time and the fortitude to deal with this SA crapola.
And remember, it is my plan to NOT live in this house forever, since I simply cannot imagine being here without him. I’d hate living here. And, I plan to move far, far away. Like Europe. 🙂 But I don’t want to be thrown out either. I want to leave on my terms. And I don’t care if when I leave, he’s left holding the unsellable house (in this market anyway) and has to make payments on it and upkeep while I’m away. 🙂
But I do need to prepare myself and make sure I know all of the potential pitfalls, so thank you for offering that info.
Love,
Paula
Okay, I just did this. If nothing pops up, does that mean there is no spyware? Or does it mean that it’s a different kind of spyware?
Nap,
If I am remembering correctly, he wasn’t much taller than me. I’m 5’8″. Maybe 5’10”. 6′ at the most?
I did have a picture of him that I snapped that day… will have to look for it!
In the meantime, here are the pictures that were in our local newspaper. I pinned them to my Pinterest board, but the pictures themselves aren’t showing up as a thumbnail. Hmmmm. But, I think if you click on the text part, you’ll be taken to the right page where you can see the pictures. I’m the blonde in the green shirt (the one with no makeup and my just out of the shower hair! No kidding, I had dropped my daughter off at kindergarten and realized that this was THE DAY but didn’t have time to go home and fix myself up to meet my soul mate. Alas.)
Here’s the link: http://pinterest.com/thetweenandme/celebrities/
Let me know if you can’t see the pictures and I’ll figure something else out.
I still love him. And now I can’t wait to hear him whispering sweet messages in MY ear!